[JordanD]

Indeed Martyn; the South Korean Ministry of Transport “reported the captain (43, ATPL, 9,793 hours total) of the ill-fated flight was still under supervision doing his first landing into San Francisco on a Boeing 777, although he had 29 landings into San Francisco on other aircraft types before.” (Source: website below)

May I suggest readers take a look at the latest updates on the AV Herald website, which give the NTSB read outs of the final approach:

http://avherald.com/h?article=464ef64f&opt=0

[canucklad]

Hi Craig and Martyn…

My premise is based on Ian’s post earlier at 04.02…..and the reliance on automation……

Then add in a shimmering sea, a runway that is also heat shimmering…then a visual glance can suddenly become disorientating….especially if you believe your instruments are correct….

Bluntly put…it looked like the plane landed early and the crew didn’t realise until too late that they weren’t above the threshold…

[StandingThemUp]

With PAPI available, there should have been no doubt about the glidepath required, that’s why they are there, shimmering sea and sun notwithstanding.

[craigwatson]

The fact that the speed was so low, to me, means that they were well out of touch with what was going on around them.

Are we sure the PAPI’s were working? I had heard they were U/S as well, not that that should make any difference.

[StandingThemUp]

craig, are you 777 rated perchane?

IIRC (some years ago) a 777 driver told me there is a mode named FLCH that can be used to get down very quickly, but the autothrust ‘goes to sleep’ and the speed can decay quite quickly.

Of course, I don’t know if that happened here, but I could imagine a scenario where it occurred.

The small planes I used had this type of failure hard coded into them, as the autopilot could command a rate of climb or descent in a VS mode, but there was no autothrottle, so you had to be very careful. Inadvertent selection could be disastrous.

Apparently the PAPIs were available, until wiped out by the crash.

[craigwatson]

not rated on a 777, but I have heard rumors that they were in FLCH

[BigDog.]

Ok not the best source however the DM raises a fair point about the seats and injuries.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2358789/Call-airline-seats-designed-emerges-San-Francisco-crash-survivors-suffering-spinal-injuries.html

[MartynSinclair]

An approach over water brings the same “awareness” issues as an approach over a desert. As others have said, it should be normal for a pro pilot as it should be for a well trained non pro pilot.

[Cloud-9]

I heard that one of the dead schoolgirls actually survived the crash, but was killed by an emergency vehicle.

Does anybody have any further info on the veracity or not of this?

[AMcWhirter]

There were also reports today that a couple of flight attendants were ejected from the B777 when it crashed. Both are alive to tell the tale but must have been badly injured.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57593064/2-asiana-flight-attendants-ejected-in-crash-and-found-on-runway-feds-say/

[canucklad]

It’s getting worse for the crew, without knowing the finite details…according to this mornings news…..

The order to evacuate took 90 seconds after the plane came to a stop.

Raises a couple of serious questions about “behavioural recruitment and training” …It might explain the passenger’s hand luggage behaviour.

1) Why did the cockpit crew not understand the critical situation they where in?
2) Almost proving the point of previous comments….seeing the destruction in front of them why did the cabin crew not use their imitative and take immediate action to evacuate?

Not sure if I would be 100% comfortable flying this airline now !

[JonathanM8]

The flight attendents who were thrown out of the rear of the plane were obviously on the jump seats at the back of the cabin in the rear galley area. Amazing, really, that they survived this, given that the aircraft was travelling at over 100mph as it struck the sea wall.

[superchris]

Im also reading the pilots are claiming they saw a flash of light, a laser which distracted them……

[MartynSinclair]

This is an interesting simulation of the accident… which includes ATC recordings.

http://mashable.com/2013/07/14/flight-214-animation/

[AllOverTheGaff]

Wow, very scary sim.

[Author]

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