[TominScotland]

Bucksnet – interestingly put… Not sure that the unemployment/ illegal workers thing is quite as simple as you imply. Notwithstanding high unemployment, there are many jobs undertaken by illegals which many Brits would not undertake. Ex-RBS traders washing dishes in their local Chinese restaurant? Mmmmmmmm

[VintageKrug]

Hmm. I think Bucksnet would be better off here:

http://www.ukip.org/

[Bucksnet]

Forget politics VK, how about just enforcing the law?

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

“Hmm. I think Bucksnet would be better off here:

http://www.ukip.org/“

Remind us, VK, which poster was complaining about being named recently?

[MartynSinclair]

“how about just enforcing the law?”

Child benefit alone, as previously posted, there is so much leaving the country.

UK Plc, needs to know who’s in and who’s out (doesn’t every company need to know its stock levels?). When you’re out, benefits can stop, unless you back in, when benefits can begin.

Oh, how can this debate not be political (although UKBA does fall under a travel discussion).

Would love to have a discussion on how good pensions are (for those if us that travel), but guess that would be too political.

[RichHI1]

OK I see two issues, security and crime and second immigration.
Stopping criminals or terrorists entering the country is a job for the border force backed up by police information. As regards immigration, UKBA border force have the role to keepmout those who are not qualified from entering. Once here then adherence to work restrictions and visa length are probably more effectively managed by steps ensuring nonone is paid by annemployer without a thorough work permit and
Ni / tax credentials check. The current system is inefficient and inaccurate. Also police should have powers to ask anyone whom they have cause to suspect of illegal activity to produce their passport and visa status. Checking outbound is like locking the stable door after the horse has bolted. Given that some travellers use one passport on way in and other on way out and euros are not required to show a passport the precision of in and out can be dubious.

[RichHI1]

To unnamed poster who has been known to act as general apologist for the current administration, Theresa may and the IAG / BA but has no connection of commercial or professional nature other than stockholding…
It may come as a surprise that deep suspicion about the lack of democracy , transparency and efficiency coupled with an underlying socialist agenda and the creation of a greater Germany in the eurozone is not confined to the UKIP. There are many members of the Conservative and Labour parties who do not wish the current situation to continue. Perhaps the difference with the UKIP being a minor party has an alignment between membership and leadership on the issue of the EU and not being in apposition of government allows it to stick to it’s election rhetoric in a way that the major parties fail to do paying the price for power with some of their integrity.

[MartynSinclair]

“Given that some travellers use one passport on way in and other on way out and euros are not required to show a passport the precision of in and out can be dubious.”

Every time a problem at UKBA is discussed the excuse given for not being able to change policy or protocol is EUROPE EUROPE EUROPE.

Is it not about time that the UK Government can take control of running its borders and implement a policy that actually secures and protects.

Travelers using one passport in and another out should not be allowed and could very easily be checked as happens in the US and even Thailand.

UK Plc like any other business needs to know what stock is in and what stock is out! The cost savings in benefit fraud alone should pay for any cost involved to implement this.

Before DoS comes in and mentions the fines levied against the UK for any border control protocol against Europe rules, to be a super power you have to claim diplomatic immunity over such trivialities as fines

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23971225-barack-obama-convoy-fined-over-congestion-charge.do

[RichHI1]

Martyn the USA does nor operate passport checks on departure. The airlines collect this data as a security rather than an immigration measure. Visitors using a visa have their i94 forms returned but this data tends to be uaed specifically rather than statistically. Immigration measures such as Social security and immigration employer checks, secure d/l and ID’s requiring documentation and laws like AZ for status checks have been used. The US faces a massive immigration issue. Interestingly the focus is often on mexicans bur there are many many illegal canadians in USA who have failed to comply with migration reqs ovwrstayed their limit and just remained.
Totally agree on Europe being reaaon dor many issues but at present all party machines are eurofocussed. It does seem that it will take some drastic voting to ahock them to act but even I find it hard to bote UkIp.

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

“Given that some travellers use one passport on way in and other on way out and euros are not required to show a passport the precision of in and out can be dubious.”

As I said, a coarse check, x in plus 58 million minus y out, gives you a sense of the trend in illegals.

Martyn, nice example, but unfortunately not appropriate. The US has always argued immunity from local taxation under diplomatic protocols, whereas the UK signed up for Europe.

Having said that, there is no European based reason I’m aware of why the UK should not check passports in and out, it’s just lack of UK will to do this.

I’m in Paris today and will fly to London this evening; as I’m leaving Schengen, I’ll go through a passport check by the French authorities on departure. As the UK is not in Schengen, it can legitimately check in and out.

[MartynSinclair]

Rich, if a traveler does not return their I 94 on departure, they will have a problem when next arriving at border control unless it has been noticed by the passenger and they bring their previous boarding card with them.

On arrival in the States, immigration always seem to be able to correct me if I get my previous US travel dates wrong. This also applies to other family members who have visas.

Using a different passport to enter and leave a country is dubious in itself and would only usually be done by someone with something to hide or to take advantage of a ‘system’.

[MartynSinclair]

DoS, if the French hold you for any reason, please make sure you are allowed to keep your internet access so you can update us all.

[RichHI1]

Martyn you are correct, as I said i94 returns are used specifically but they are not used staistically. Esta visitors and aliens with no visa requirement such as Canadian citizens are not checked out other than by airline records which may or may not be passed on (flights to Canada are treated differently).

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

“Using a different passport to enter and leave a country is dubious in itself and would only usually be done by someone with something to hide or to take advantage of a ‘system’.”

Not necessarily so.

Some citizens with dual nationality are obliged to use the passport of their country of citizenship when entering it.

Ergo, as the airline will enter their details onto the manifest, they need to show that passport, so that is one explanation why they may use different ones.

Of course there are less benevolent situations, too.

“DoS, if the French hold you for any reason, please make sure you are allowed to keep your internet access so you can update us all.”

Do you know something that I don’t?

[TerryMcManus24]

Martyn…wife uses 2 passports…UK/EU to leave Blighty and Thai when entering……..and she I assure you has nothing to hide.Other small advantages are that visas for Thai/duel nationals can be cheaper..eg China…cost me double and that was from Portland Place Embassy.She also has the big red UK-RTR stamp in her T -PP which causes confusion at Suwanna check in sometimes…not seen very ofter but apart from that “no poblem”.

[Author]

Posts