City Jet sell-off?
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at 20:40 by AMcWhirter.
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transtraxmanParticipantThe CityJet deal has been sealed.
Seen in Travel Weekly 2-5-14
“CityJet targets return to profitability under new owner”CityJet and subsidiary VLM began operating independently yesterday(1st May).
Intro Aviation says,“We don’t want to change anything except to make better.” This means that the airline will operate mainly from London City and still maintain its commercial relationaship with Air France but be open to partner other airlines.
There are no plans to combine CityJet with Intro´s other subsidiary InterSky.
The only comment about money is the significant, “We start debt free and will re-brand the company in June….”
3 May 2014
at 17:53
MarcusUKParticipantRe-branding is good for Cityjet, and they can shed the AF links.
However, the aircraft remain old and tatty, unpleasant to travel inside, and with the same CEO, if she cannot even keep the aircraft clean inside what is she doing remaining there?Too many good Airlines will take their market share, as already happened with BA, and is with FlyBe. It will be too late bringing in new aircraft later than next year. in my view, they will not succeed from LCY anymore.
Cambridge services with an old Fokker 50 – 25yrs circa old? Sure they will be very popular!AF and KLM would be far better to run their own aircraft and crews, as CityJet simply does not match their standards, well KLM at least!
3 May 2014
at 19:32
AMcWhirterParticipantThe DT article doesn’t say when the incident took place …
But as noted in above postings, the airline will shortly be ordering new aircraft to replace its 146 jets which have been in regular service for many years.
15 May 2014
at 09:48
s2art1eParticipantThis morning 7:25. Cityjet seriously needs these birds replaced, they have an ageing fleet, maybe this will speed things up.
15 May 2014
at 12:11
rjhcambsParticipantRe-MarcusUK 3/5/14. I tried the new Dublin to Cambridge service which started this week using an old F50. Outward, I went on a BA A319 from LHR with worn looking seats but at least these are more comfortable than the new ones. Despite what has been said on this thread I was pleasantly surprised on my return to CBG by the condition of the F50. The leather seat was comfortable, leg room restricted but as there was only three of us on the flight it was fine and the interior seemed clean enough. Service from the single FA was fine with Drinks and nibbles similar to BA – fare was €49.
If flying from small regional airports means using old aircraft that’s Ok with me. I arrived home two hours quicker than via LHR and avoided STN/Ryanair. Also I got a great cloudless view flying in over my village and on landing at CBG was in the car within five mins. I hope Cityjet’s service lasts longer than Darwin/Ethiad Regional’s attempt last year. Local advertising seems very limited so I am not hopeful. For any locals reading this they also fly twice a day to AMS as well as DUB and once weekly at weekends.15 May 2014
at 13:38
MarcusUKParticipantWell, it seems clear pour perceptions of their fleet are accurate. Good job your wing and propellers didn’t fall apart then!
Their fleet i checked outlined the fokker 50’s 21-27 years old! All avro’s were over 15 yrs old. I have seen them decline over 3 years and would no longer fly with them from LCY. Their flights are not busy and they have lost many routes in the last 6 months, EDI has been completely taken over by BSA doubling the amount of flights from LCY.
Why could they not make these flights work compared to BA?Clearly travellers do not like the aircraft or service, and prefer the new Embraer’s run by BA.
Renewing the fleet in a year or two will not work in my view. Many other Airlines will and have taken their routes and loyalty.
Cambridge was taken on with Etihad Regional some months ago and then cancelled, as it clearly did not work. With far older aircraft, I cannot in any way see that Cityjet with their old fleet and tired service will do any better.
I also flew a very run down and frankly filthy BA A320 from LHR a year ago in business, it was appalling, in every aspect of the aircraft, ground both ends, and in flight service.
Maybe you should try KLM from LHR, brand new aircraft, great service, and impeccably maintained aircraft.15 May 2014
at 21:19
SimonS1ParticipantMarcus – presumably it would be quite easy to substitute “wing and propellers fall apart” with “engine falls apart as cowls left unlatched” or “engine destroyed as baggage scanner left in engine” or “cabin held together with duct tape” etc etc.
Struggling to see what your point really is? Aircraft of 21-27 years old are fine if maintained properly.
15 May 2014
at 21:38
MarcusUKParticipantClearly they are not maintained properly!
Neither are they cleaned properly inside.
Which is a pretty basic need for everyone?
Not just clean floor, seats without rotting food down them, even mucus from sneezes on the window, blood on the side panels, or stained and mouldy tray tables…we all got to the point of carrying alcogel to clean the tables, but the windows could not be cleaned without scratching it with your nail it was so filthy, and probably riddled with bacteria. Sometimes the same aircraft, week after week remained the same.
Just a few of the items 5 i know of, have found on these flight, until we ceased flying with them!
BA run their Embraer’s on the same route, so why would you choose Citijet compared?Neither are they economical with 4 engines, which is one of many many reasons including reducing carbon emissions, why Decent Airlines try to purchase new Aircraft with greater technology, and safety.
I have flown older aircraft many times, but they were never dirty, unsafe or unclean.
Citijet is Not!16 May 2014
at 09:39
SimonS1ParticipantMarcus – my point is these maintenance issues can happen on any airline, as the BA issues with the baggage scanner and the engine cowls are concerned. And aren’t BA regularly criticised for the internal state of some of their older planes (eg 747s).
As for the bit about wing and propellers “falling apart”, isn’t that a bit sensationalist? In any case what incident are you referring to as there is no suggestion in the articles above that the propellers were affected in any way and the wing didn’t exactly fall apart either did it – the plane returned for a normal landing.
The planes may be in need of a clean but that doesn’t make them unsafe any more that BA’s 747s. However you clearly feel that Cityjet have a safety record in some way so maybe you could share some stats from their safety record that would illustrate that? Then we can be alert to the dangers of using them.
For the record I’m not a great supporter of Cityjet, occasional flights to Antwerp on the F50, however I am genuinely struggling to see to what extent what you are saying about safety is fact or just part of your general obsession with moaning about everything from the sale to the CEO to the safety etc etc.
16 May 2014
at 09:58
TominScotlandParticipantSimonS1 +1
Marcus, not being pedantic but what is the difference between dirty and unclean? Like Simon, I think you need to provide evidence that Cityjet operate unsafe aircraft and maybe pass on this evidence to the civil aviation authorities.
In terms of aircraft age, remember that your beloved KLM operate a fleet of F70s which range in age from 17 to 19 years, not that much different from Cityjet!
16 May 2014
at 10:08
AMcWhirterParticipantIt can happen to any airline and, probably, any airplane …
But yesterday the windscreen of a CityJet plane bound for LCY developed a crack shortly after take-off from DUB, accarding to the Irish Times.
The plane had to make an emergency landing back in DUB.
23 May 2014
at 10:49
MarcusUKParticipantUnclean (as in “Clean and hygienic”) in Health and Safety terms, means unhealthy, unhygienic, a danger to others, bacteria, developing health hazards.
Cityjet were told of this problem 2 years ago. Mouldy food down the seat backs, under the seats, and windows so unhygienic, that you have to scrape the deposits off with a nail or something sharp. I have seen people sneeze onto the window.
Indeed KLM has the older Fokker 70’s they are phasing out, as they have retired the F 100’s completely. Almost a 70 % fleet renewal so far in 6 years.
But they do not develop cracks, components of wings fall away, and are impeccably maintained, and never rubbish, or unhygienic in any way.
I pity Citjet having to cut back so much which is why they are being deserted in droves it seems, Other Airlines are indeed taking their business. If it was a hotel, they would be closed down!
Pleased they have been taken out of Skyteam, and no longer associated with the Alliance. they just do not meet the standards.
3 years ago, they were fine, and i used them weekly, but not now. An Airline in its final stages.
23 May 2014
at 14:14
SimonS1ParticipantLet’s see Marcus.
KLM never develop cracks? What about this one – only last year?
http://avherald.com/h?article=45f5ff39
Or this one in 2012? On a Fokker 70 no less!!
http://avherald.com/h?article=44ae28e2
Or even this one in 2012?
http://www.theklmsource.com/ph-bfk-kl685-amsterdam-cracked-windscreen-return/
And isn’t KLM to decide on a replacement for Fokker 70s by year end. Just like Cityjet is decide on a replacement for Avros by year end. So what is the difference (leaving aside your obvious personal bias).
And of course KLM never have dirty planes…do they?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgBGxCUKL3M
I do occasionally use Cityjet to Antwerp so like Tom I am awaiting the evidence you will sending to the CAA about Cityjet operating unsafe planes as I need to decide whether to find an alternative route and/or top up my life insurance.
Sorry but let’s face it you are like the VintageKrug of KLM, so biased that it’s hard to take you seriously.
23 May 2014
at 15:53 -
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