[MartynSinclair]

I recall when the secure cockpit doors were initially installed, they cost over $1 million each..!

This is such a sad story and I cant help the feeling the irony that this million dollar door, is really one of the main contributing factors to the tragedy…

[BigDog.]

Personal privacy trumps public safety..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35797065

Personally methinks the rights of the individual over public good/safety have gone too far, this is merely an example.

[MrMichael]

This is difficult one, on the one hand if a doctor knows a pilot is not fit to fly he should have a duty to inform the authorities. On the other, if that is the case a pilot that thinks he might be unwell will either not go to the doctor, or find a doctor to treat him that does not know his occupation. I think whatever the outcome there will be the rare case of pilots with serious health issues flying us around. In a way safety and reporting are the same, report a piloting error for the benefit of the airline industry, but pisdibly end up down the job centre as a consequence. The above issues are not dissimilar to those in the rail industry, and no easy answer exists. They also exist in other industry’s, just look at the bin man in Gladgow.

[LuganoPirate]

Surely the answer must be for whoever leaves the cockpit to carry a key so they can get back in. Perhaps a senior cabin crew member should have one as well?

[MartynSinclair]

I consider myself a very frequent flyer….. but I still feel a little more than “slightly uncomfortable” seeing 1 of the 2 pilots chatting with the cabin crew mid flight in the galley (shorthaul).. 95% of my flights are with BA…

[ba747fan1]

I thought 2 authorised personnel were meant to be on the flight deck at all times. However, on BA I also reguarly see one of the flight dedck chatting in the galley (or indeed I have chatted to them). However, I assume on short haul that this must mean that the pilot or first officer is by themselves at this time?

[openfly]

On the Virgin Dreamliner the flight crew are frequently outside the flight deck and in the cabin. The closest loo is at the back of Upper Class. So much for security!

[LuganoPirate]

You’re right Ba fan, I’ve seen that as well that a crew member must enter the cockpit. I assume that member must be bigger than the pilot left alone?

[BigDog.]

With respect gentlemen, I have been informed by a couple of pilots that these changes are more to assuage public/media concern than to provide a realistic mechanism which prevents a pilot melt-down becoming a catastrophe.
Even with 2 people in the cock pit – should one wish to take a catastrophic action, at a specific time, little/nothing can be done to prevent it.

[FDOS_UK]

BigDog. – 14/03/2016 11:51 GMT

From my very limited experience of big iron operation, the pilot comments would seem to be reasonable.

It would be child’s play to use ‘g’ forces to disable a third person, unless they were strapped in and if there were, unless they were a pilot, they would not understand what a suicidal pilot was doing… and there would be a limited window of opportunity to prevent disaster – remembering the AA A300 that lost it’s vertical stabiliser over Jamaica Bay, it only took 2-3 full rudder reversal to do that.

Having said that, I really do think this incident (whilst appalling and dreadful for people who lost loved ones) is a true black swan and thus a one off.

[canucklad]

Surely Lufthansa employ in-house doctors ……
And if they do. Is there anything illegal with medical professionals sharing confidential patient information with each other without breaking secrecy laws? By doing so it could be argued that the medical profession as a whole are working in the patients best interest.
After all here in the UK our medical records are available to many different teams within the NHS .

[FDOS_UK]

canucklad – 14/03/2016 12:35 GMT

I seem to remember having to give permission for my personal data to be shared across the NHS, when I registered last year.

Perhaps this guy did not authorise sharing?

I do get your point, though. Perhaps some professions need to have this kind of reporting as default.

[travelworld2]

I think this is a very difficult area with a real danger that the proposed solution will actually make things worse not better. It seems to me that a pilot is less likely to seek help if he knows that in doing so his employer will be told. or he’ll go to a different doctor and keep his profession a secret. There is also the risk of many, many pilots who are actually fit to fly being prohibited from doing so by an abundance of caution . Whilst the Germanwings episode is truly shocking, the number of incidents where something similar may have happened can be counted on the fingers of two hands. Given the number of flights flown daily the chances of it happening to anyone are incredibly small. After all, if we wanted a wholly risk free existence we’d never go anywhere or do anything. Whilst it goes against the grain of every tragic event requiring a tightening of procedures and regulations it may be that the correct response to this is to do nothing.

[MrMichael]

Travelworld, I agree other than what has been done by most airlines in having two people in the cockpit. It has been said (including by me earlier in the thread) that another person might not be able to do something, true, but at least those on board have a fighting chance rather than no chance at all. For me, two in the cockpit is all we we can have, and perhaps the person leaving the cockpit taking the key.

[MartynSinclair]

“I think this is a very difficult area with a real danger that the proposed solution will actually make things worse not better. It seems to me that a pilot is less likely to seek help if he knows that in doing so his employer will be told. or he’ll go to a different doctor and keep his profession a secret.”

IMHO – I do not think this is a difficult situation. Aircrew should agree for all medical records to be released to their employers medical team and in the event of Aircrew being caught out, not disclosing medical information (including visiting private Dr’s) it should be considered as seriously as failing an alcohol test (edited away from ‘becoming a criminal offence).

The ease which I could obtain pills, including one which is now a class A drug, in prescription in the UK and overseas was ridiculously easy. Did it affect my judgement when flying? Absolutely, every time. What amazed me more than anything, it was never revealed in my regular blood checks.

I know we are discussing psychological issues, which are far harder to detect, but as Aircrew who fail an alcohol test are generally sent to jail, I believe Aircrew that fail to disclose visits to a private GP, should also be dealt with in a similar and harsh fashion. Aircrew medical departments must increase their monitoring skills

Aircrew have people’s safety as their priority (that’s what they say).. Withholding any medical issue from their employer, especially medication or treatment, needs to be dealt with and harshly.

I know of MANY Aircrew who can’t travel without taking unprescribed sleeping pills…

[Author]

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