[FDOS_UK]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_balloon

It couldn’t possibly be a trial balloon, could it 😉

[MrMichael]

As a BA supporter, is the decision to go BOB good for me or bad for me.?

First though I would like to challenge a few things that people either did not know or choose to forget.

Some have mentioned looking at the Vueling/Ryanair/Finnair/SAS/Easyjet model. Surely though the model to compare is Iberia, an IAG so called full service airline that has domestic, euro and Inter-continental flights. So the model BA is following is actually IB,s.

The £3 per person catering bill per pax, if true, amounts to a whopping £40m per annum. Nobody can suggest that is a minor saving, it might be a saving hard to digest ( deliberate pun!) but peanuts it ain’t (another pun…).

FDOS suggests too much BA bashing on here. I know he was smiling when he wrote that, and I smile too when I write I disagree with him. BA bashing seems to give so much pleasure to so many people. Everyone has a vice, mine is tobacco, BA bashers need to be weaned off it by being persuaded to buy shares in one of the worlds most successful flag carriers.

Back to BOB. Back to the race to the bottom. The fact is with very few exceptions the Airlines of Europe have been trying to squeeze every last Cent Penny and Sloti out of their assets, what I call, sweating the assets. They do it because shareholders insist on it, survival depends on it, and pax keep buying it in more and more droves. Nobody flies because they want a tea and a wrap, they fly to get from a to b. That might sound obvious, but it seems to be being missed here. People will grumble as it is another erosion of the magic of flight, the glamour, the exotic destinations, the glamorous hostesses etc etc. The reality now is it is mass transit, not luxury for the minority. If enough people were willing to pay enough do you not think BA and others would jump at putting First Class with all the trimmings back on to their planes. Of course they would, but the days past where money for airlines was made from the premium cabin are gone….long gone. Now we are to see this model extend to Long Haul, Norwegian, 777’s with ten across, one can see it coming. Horrible yes, regrettable yes, but it is 21st century reality.

[lesmclaren]

Openfly. Seems BA staff are in total ignorance and/or denial as always!! Although of course if could all be BA “flying a kite” to see what sort of reaction they will get [yes I mean WILL get] when they do introduce this. Of course the upside would be that BA management may be reading our remarks if they are flying a kite, not of course that it would make any difference as BA never listen to the paying customer.
As previously written by Big Dog, the Telegraph on line article is well worth a read: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/comment/british-airways-to-charge-for-meals-budget-airline/
As many others have said, I also was a very loyal [stupid?] BA Gold customer for 23 years. This year I have done 1 paid sector [normally by now it would be close to 20].
Moved my business to mainly KLM and SAS. I would say KLM have a good balance, pay a little more if you want a bit more leg room. Snack and drink [soft, tea, coffee or beer /wine] a small snack or cake/biscuit depending on time of day. Free bag from Blue member increasing with status. All in economy short haul. O yes, and generally good prices and excellent service!

[lesmclaren]

Mr Michael. I am sure you count me well and truly in the BA basher camp.
I do respect your unswerving loyalty to BA and of course much of what you say regarding travel in the 21st centaury is fine logic, however you miss a basic point and that is if BA want to compete at the bottom, which of course they have every right to do, then they should come clean and admit it, make the changes, reduce the fares and go the full nine yards. This would of course also allow them to consolidate their brands to one which I would argue would bring the greatest savings they could ever hope to achieve. Lets face it, this is possibly the greatest advantages that Ryan, Easy Norwegian et al have – only one brand to support.
The second point you miss is that many of us want to have choice and be treated as human beings and not cattle, this may well mean we are willing to pay a bit more and expect some “comforts”. If BA does not want to be part of this then refer to point one. As is clearly obvious many many former loyal BA customers [me included] have voted with our feet. BA may not care or want our business, after all I do agree with you that there are equally many people who only want to pay for basic service. So let BA emulate the Norwegian [long and short haul] model and get on with it.
This gives victory to the shareholders, the low end market and ends BA bashing!! – but I can’t avoid saying how sad it will be to see one of the Worlds oldest and formally best airlines reduced to “just another mass people mover”.

[rferguson]

I’m not against paying for food on a short haul flight. With a few caveats
1. the food available for sale is reasonably priced, of a high quality and a decent selection.
2. soft drinks, tea and coffee remain free – it’s interesting to note that all the media reports are using the term ‘BA is to charge for FOOD on short haul flights’.
And most importantly –
3. The revenue raised/cost taken out of the business by introducing BOB will be reinvested in improving the product elsewhere. Hello Club World!!

The BA CEO today was quotes as saying “We are evaluating the options carefully. If we commit to changes, I want them to produce the best onboard provision of food in the whole European short-haul sector.” In BA-speak that is tantamount to confirmation.

So, OK. Providing they still offer competitive fares I don’t think people will be too bothered in not getting a free G&T and bag of crisps on a 50 minute flight. Worst case scenario – if the backlash is SO huge ‘do an Austrian’ and revert back to free catering.

But put the money saved towards areas that REALLY matter. Club World just doesn’t cut it as a premium long haul product anymore. It needs some serious investment.

**My personal opinions only**

[MrMichael]

Lesmclaren, you mention your willing to pay a bit more for not being treated like cattle. Absolutely understand that. The point is “the bit more” is not enough to make it worthwhile. The perks of travelling Club Europe have been eroded over many years to the extent that one has to question just how much it is worth.

Nothing wrong with being a BA basher, I think even BA bashers are nice people underneath:-). I guess I am just resigned to the fact as travel gets cheaper and more crowded that cramming people in and shifting them ASAP is going to be the only way to profit from it.

[Londonian]

rferguson -on the nail as always.

[AllOverTheGaff]

MrMichael – 16/05/2016 20:04 BST
BA bashers need to be weaned off it by being persuaded to buy shares in one of the worlds most successful flag carriers.

I can only assume your tongue was firmly in your cheek with that one. 🙂

Re BOB, I’ve stated elsewhere on the thread, I truly don’t care. I don’t fly BA to LHR from EDI for a biscuit and cup of revolting warm brown fluid which they laughingly refer to as ‘coffee’. EZY’s on board product is a lot better, sorry if that offends, but it is true. Good selection and reasonably tasty, albeit over-priced for what it is, but the flights are cheap enough to offset.

I hope they’d use the saving to offer better food/drinks in the long-haul premium cabins, alas, I think almost all of us, BA fans or ‘bashers’ know they won’t. I don’t really use BA short haul now, at all, and only in 1st if the price is right on long-haul as their business class is woeful. Fly almost any other airline with direct aisle access in the J cabin, you won’t fly BA again. (From my experience) But 1st class, if the price is good is doable – I booked two Rio flights today in 1st and got change from £4K, (each) not bad at all. I also booked KLM same route on their new Dreamliner for £1.6K, if the food and lounges aren’t as good, I’ll console myself with the £2K I saved and have a night at Royal Hospital Road on BA. Or maybe Ducasse at the Dorchester……

Where was I? Oh yes, BOB, BAB and BBFB (Buy-On-Board/British Airways Bashing/Bye-Bye-Free-Booze), **IF** the BA marketing brain-trust get together and promise the savings from short haul will go to making their long haul food offering better, and they deliver, it could be a bit of a win actually, I’d bet the farm it’ll just be yet another saving for the shareholders though.

To Fly to Save.
Rgds.
AOTG.

[AllOverTheGaff]

rferguson – 16/05/2016 20:49 BST
But put the money saved towards areas that REALLY matter. Club World just doesn’t cut it as a premium long haul product anymore. It needs some serious investment.

+1

[MrMichael]

Ok, my take on let’s say £40m saving from introducing BOB on short haul. As a shareholder in IAG one might expect me to say that I should have it, but actually I don’t. Short haul is very much a feeder to Long Haul, so to protect that lucrative part of the business an improvement in Long haul biz would make sense. If people have a short haul ” BA loco” followed by a good long haul product then people are more likely to buy in to it. So I would say fine, invest most of the savings in to an improved long haul premium product, improve the catering experience. Another £3 on a long haul meal would make one heck of a difference. That protects both parts of the business, leaving the point to point to choose BA and the true Loco,s. Maybe a few pence for the shareholders…….please?

[WillieWelsh]

All this suggestion that money generated from sales on short haul may be invested in long haul is in my view misguided.

BA have already been clear about the success of their sale of premium meals in economy in long haul – generating money. I would predict that BOB short haul will soon be extended to BOB long haul albeit choose and buy in advance maybe at the time of booking.

To begin with the paid for economy meals will look premium but bit by bit quality will be reduced and costs increase until you are paying maybe £30/sector and rising for the same slop as they give away today.

[openfly]

The likes of Emirates, with so many connections from the Eastern hemisphere into the UK and Europe, must be rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of BAs plans for BoB.
So many economy and premium economy passengers, connecting over LHR, will see the product offered by EK etc as more attractive to get to their destination. BA might regret a decision to go BoB.

[rferguson]

WilliWelsh – yes the ‘success’ of the longhaul ‘gourmet’ BOB range nearly made me spit out my tea when I read it! I saw my very first one in the World Traveller cabin last week. And I think they’ve been around for months now. Had absolutely no idea what one looked like until then.

I can’t see the same happening for long haul tbh – it was only last year that they spent money on enhancing the Y class long haul catering, Pretzels back with the pre flight drink. Cheese and biscuits back on the Y class meal trays. Two hot meals on UK-US West Coast flights, On longhaul there is an absolute expectation of free catering from a ‘full service’ airline. On european shorthaul the lines are becoming blurred.

In terms of the longhaul competition BA fears think less EK and more VS/DL. And potentially Norwegian long haul. With DL’s investment in VS they are coming up and up on the transatlantic routes and BA are panicking. They are poaching BA’s ‘bread and butter’ punters.

**My personal opinions only**

[dutchyankee]

@ openfly – 17/05/2016 08:32 BST

I am no fan of Emirates, but recognise their great success, and isn’t it true that they will soon be introducing a Premium Economy, so even more to your point, that would remove one of the last advantages the likes of BA or LH have?

[dutchyankee]

In relation to long haul meal purchase, some posters on here have stated that KLM offer a rather good quality of meals that you can purchase for long haul above and beyond their normal meals. Are those on BA that different?

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