[icenspice]

Acapulco?

Seriously though, I wonder how Lima and San Jose × 2 lol are doing?

Great to hear from you sparkyflyer!

[TheLion]

[quote quote=772893]There are quite a few cities they have listed here which I would love to go to,but these schedules and timings are useless for me sadly.

Oakland is all about attacking Norwegian, I suspect FLL as well, although they should have started it years ago! I am sure former posted VK will be totally excited by this route, even if they are operated by clapped out 772s!

Cape Town from LGW was also started to stop Norwegian trying it out.

But whilst the recent routes are mainly in the Americas, could African routes be started from LGW – a safari/beach route with a triangle ( I know BA don’t do triangles but maybe Mr Cruz has some imagination) to Tanzania with Dar and Kilimanjaro?

And West Africa there has to be demand – how about 4 flights a week to Abidjan- with 2 each flights stopping in Monrovia and Freetown. After all, Air France now fly there 11 times a week, including daily A380s..

Re Colombia, with the State Visit of President Santos to UK, and PM May vowing to boost trade, could this be a good time for BA to announce Bogota, at long last..

[/quote]

Great to hear from you Sparkyflyer. This thread really needs refreshment, with more engagement. Previously so enthusiastic, everyone seems to be away!

Yes OAK and FLL are definitely there to target Norwegian, although FLL will also be for cruise traffic and for those who live or are visiting on the Central Florida coast (aka Gold Coast).

OAK also opens up the interior. I do think this route can work well given that it serves a large catchment area and hinterland in CA. It is very convenient for Oakland, Sacramento, Fremont, Stockton, Antioch, Reno, Lake Tahoe, northern Nevada etc and is also a great option for a fly/drive holiday up or down the coast. There’s also a range of connecting opportunities at LGW that may help, especially to Italy and Spain.

As for new routes, I could see O&D-heavy African routes like DAR, EBB (Entebbe), ROB (Monrovia), FNB (Freetown), DUR, HRE (post-Mugabe obviously) and LUN working from LGW, however the connection potential for BA’s North American network from LHR is probably too good to pass up so I’d doubt they’d try any of these from LGW. They are all viable from LHR in my view however. Add to them ABJ (Abidjan), DKR (Dakar) and PHC (Port Harcourt) for resources and that’s a strong sub-Saharan African network.

With Royal Air Maroc looking likely to join One World, BA should also launch A321 mid haul service to CMN (Casablanca) to tap into RAM’s network of African connections with a good product for both legs. This could then be upgauged to a B788/B772 as the route prospers.

Now more likely from LGW in the short term are leisure routes such as JRO (which you mention), SEZ, ZNZ, possibly MBA (Mombasa) & LXR (Luxor) if things improve in Kenya & Egypt to the point that large numbers of tourists return. I say this due to BA’s conservatism, not beacuse I wouldn’t go there myself (I would!).

On top of this SSH (Sharm) and TUN will come back fairly soon once they are judged to be “safe”.

Finally Colombia will happen. I do think it’s a few years off however as Avianca are now daily and that route has yet to fully mature; it was barely half full when we flew to Bogotá in February/March. I could also see Lima moving to LHR eventually to serve the business market and connecting traffic.

I’ve got some more news, but first be good to hear what others think?

[sparkyflier]

Good evening The Lion and it is always good to see your posts, and when it is one of my threads I am usually hoping you are contributing with your wisdom, knowledge and insight.

Re your African ideas we are on the same page, but I cannot really see BA being so bold. I would love to see BA return to LUN, but so many routes would prosper if they knew what a triangle routing was and could do, which enables other carriers to offer two markets with one slot – for example Entebbe with Kigali, JRO with DAR etc, and in West Africa Dakar, Abidjan, Freetown and Monrovia for example.

Why BA did not do Port Harcourt I do not know -and AF & LH did and did very well, but with Crude oil at current under $50 a barrel I cannot see this coming until prices raise substantially.

Re RAM perhaps coming to Oneworld, that’s fine but their slots to the rest of Africa are at awful times generally – arriving 1-3 in the morning in many markets, not a viable alternative to AF or SN on the same routes.

I always thought Lima and Bogota should be started as one route ex-LHR, and there is business traffic as you say, and was surprised when BA announced this from LGW, and non-stop. So bold!

Re the Avianca flight, I think a reason why that flight was half full is their schedule – arriving in BOG at 4 in the morning..

Many of the new airlines into LHR from emerging markets have one thing in common- poor slots for the markets they serve – I think of Vietnam, AeroMexico and Avianca as my examples.

BA I think could make some routes work which others are having difficulty with.

But I am eager to know what “news” you have…

[Flightlevel]

Difficult to market triangle routes even with 5th freedoms because you will make a loss on the short route and that’s not good business. The advantage is you can save slots at the hub and that may be useful when airports are at capacity.

[TheLion]

Good to hear from you sparkyflyer. I just wrote a reply then deleted it!

Again then…

Agree re Africa. On Nigeria, with strong ties between the two nations, PHC will be viable either when Nigeria’s economy recovers and prospers, or when the prices of oil and other commodities rise.

Interesting info on RAM slots. Hopefully RAM will soon join OW and then codeshare with BA, EI, IB & AA. They may then improve slot timings to maximize connection opportunities.

BOG & LIM are viable on their own, although a tag with 5th freedom rights and LAN feed could have been a good option as it would permit a daily flight. Our BOG flight was full en route back to LHR actually.

Like I say, tags could work, but only with 5th freedom and only really if the distance between the two onward points is shorter, thus reducing costs. An underserved market also might help; for example LHR-JNB-DUR would not be a good choice due to the market already being well served and also the number of one stop connections which are available. LHR-LUN-GBE (Gaborone) might however, as there is currently no direct flight. Obviously market research and due diligence would first be necessary.

Now the news…

http://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2016/11/14/british-airways-aer-lingus-us-expansion/93642788

It features an interview with the beloved Wee Willie. Particularly intriguing quote: “We’re likely to make an announcement in the near future about another destination for Aer Lingus in the U.S. We could have a second.”

This morning EI indeed launched a new route, Miami:

http://www.independent.ie/life/travel/travel-news/aer-lingus-announces-three-new-direct-destinations-from-dublin-35216858.html

The second is rumoured to be San Diego. Then an aviation newsletter service I receive daily had this:

“IAG (UK) CEO Willie Walsh says there are opportunities for further expansion into the US, with new routes to be announced soon.”

I think it refers to BA too (note the IAG (UK)), so after the new BA long haul routes launched over the past few weeks, there could be more.

What do you all think? Do the hints in that article suggest further new BA routes are imminent, perhaps for mid/late summer or autumn next year?

[TheLion]

Talk of the devil. This is unbelievable: KLM launch flights to Freetown & Monrovia, a triangle route too!

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1347759

BA are asleep at the wheel. They served this profitably until Ebola forced its temporary closure, yet with their selfish attitude to Africa they never reopened it. Now their mail rival does, despite a lack of colonial ties and a hub which is barely 1.5 hours by train from another hub that does.

http://aviationtribune.com/airlines/europe/klm-strengthens-position-africa

It’s clear Willie Walsh has very little interest in letting British Airways develop routes to build a real global network, particularly in emerging markets. After Brexit BA will end up holding Britain back if they don’t start to serve this country rather than just their shareholders. They’ve alienated almost everyone. They’re far too often bad for Britain, bad for business, bad for Commonwealth countries, bad for emerging markets.

And I’m tired of hearing the “cannot be served profitably” argument. KLM, Air France, Brussels Airlines & Lufthansa all serve old colonial markets extensively and profitably, even AF. BA is the only one that doesn’t.

I personally cannot wait for this bunch of buffoons to leave.

#RantOver 😉

[sparkyflier]

+ 1 The Lion and very well expressed. BA holding UK back.

[sparkyflier]

KLM is UK’s de-facto “national” carrier for Africa and other emerging markets.

[TimFitzgeraldTC]

Slightly off topic. Virgin to axe seasonal LHR to Chicago service. An extra plane for other US services potentially (or just being placed on other flights already announced?).

[AMcWhirter]

Thanks, Tim.

Seems some airlines have realised that there will be a huge transatlantic seat glut in 2017 … witness UAL axing BFS-EWR and, just yesterday, MAN-IAD.

[AMcWhirter]

Freeing up the LHR slot will allow VS to operate a third flight to LAX.

[rferguson]

Not quite fitting in with the thread title but may be interesting for some.

BA will place a longhaul 777-200 on one of it’s daily LHR-MAD rotations from Mar 26.

BA458/459.

[AMcWhirter]

rferguson – BA seems to be falling in line with IB who already operates A330/A340 aircraft on selected services.

[DerekVH]

That is great news RF it means we can fly somewhere in Europe and have a “proper” business class seat. Mind you I can do that now on IB where at least one of their daily LHR-MAD service has an A330.

[TheLion]

Ho ho ho! Santa is here for you early with some exciting news.

Apparently BA are considering launching long haul service from MAN, with a few bucket and spade routes thrown in:

Stir that pot: BA may set up MAN base in 2017!

I’ve created a separate thread for this, as above, though feel free to discuss on here. Full details about this development are discussed on a-net:

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1350637

Incidentally this (BA Longhaul 2017+ ex LHR & LGW) thread is in the All Airlines folder so doesn’t get that many views. Maybe someone could move it to the BA folder to improve visibility?

Lastly, has anyone recently heard anything snippets of info aka rumours about future BA long haul destinations to be announced?

Maybe their next USA destination…or one of my favourite quirky, creative route planning faves like Lucknow, Maputo, Ürümqi, Georgetown & Belize City? 😉

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