[DisgustedofSwieqi]

Jonathan

Maybe all airports should operate a clear conformance policy like LHR T5. (edited to add that my comment crossed with Continental Club’s.)

It seems to me absolutely unacceptable that a passenger should be accepted at a check in desk and forfeit a flight because the airline’s subcontractor failed to get them through security in time to meet the gate cut off.

This is a matter for the airlines and their sub-contractor’s to manage, not be given to the passenger as an unquantifiable risk.

Also, EU261/2004 should be re-written so that denied boarding includes anyone still in the security queue at the time of the gate cut off.

That would focus a few minds on making the system work more efficiently.

I had an experience a few months ago at Malta, where I was in the check in queue at -2 hours 5 minutes, but only boarded the flight at STD -10 mins – in this case it was a systems problem with the airline and they waived the normal gate deadline, as they should. But it is so frustrating when stuck in such as situation.

[FlyingChinaman]

JC09: You suggestion is a good one as I have learn from two bad experiences in Europe in the past two years so I arrive early!

Having said that I only arrive one hour maximum at both HKG and SIN with almost 100% resurance that I will NEVER miss my flights as the security checking is very efficient in these Asian airports.

Unfortunately can’t say the same thing in many busy European and North American airportsl!!!

Golden rule: When in doubt arive early.

[JonathanCohen09]

Hi DoS,

I could not agree with you more, my standpoint and perhaps I should have made it clearer is that an an ideal world, what you say is absolutely true. I will be the first to sign up to any petition started to get the situation improved, we have to deal with the reality that we are faced with and it is this reality that has lead me to stick to my two hour rule.

The client I am seeing in Warsaw next week can see me on the 30th and then not for another 3 weeks and so I absolutely cannot miss my flight, particularly for a reason over which I have some control, namely getting to LTN early enough to ensure that a slow passage through security will not screw up my plans.

[MartynSinclair]

1. The T5 35 minute conformance; I think we have to accept that the terminal was designed with more room and with the security clearance challenges somewhat known.

2. Other older airports are just not designed to optomize security clearance expeditously

3. It is not just about more staff it is also about

i) educating passengers to arrive at security ready, i.e. belts off, lap tops out, liquids sealed.

ii) too many passengers fail (i) above

iii) security doesnt necessarily need more staff, just more focussed staff doing their jobs and less chitter chatter and using mobiles. There always seem to be a lot of staff standing around pretending to look busy.

iv) a clear standard for passenger security, i.e. if its belts. shoes, laptops out etc, it should be standard for each airport.. At Heathrow, it can change from terminal to terminal.

4. It will be interesting to see how the new Terminal at Heathrow is going to deal with security clearance. Ideal opportunity to showcase a new and modern approach. Perhaps a 30 minute conformance.

[KeaneJohn]

Interesting that you say you must get to your client meeting JC09 as they can’t see you for 3 weeks after that. What happens if the aircraft goes tech or the flight is cancelled for some other reason ?

Having lived in Jersey for 2 years where you rely on planes to do pretty much anything I learnt my lesson after booking the 7am flight to LGW to attend a 1pm hospital appointment in London.

Flight was delayed to 1100 due to fog, took off 1110, landed 1155 and I turned up at the hosptial at 1.10pm after calling ahead to let them know of my delay. After this, all for all future engagements, I flew the night before and stayed with my parents.

I appreciate that some people cannot factor this into their schedules and will unfortunately encounter difficulties for time to time. That said, if you have checked in on time for your flight and go straight to security you should be guaranteed travel. A good airport/airline would have managed this accordingly

[MartynSinclair]

“A good airport/airline would have managed this accordingly”

The discussion started with Easyjet and Luton. On a good day all flows nicely. A snarl up on the M1, a bit of bad weather, a cancelled flight and the airport and airline are like a pack of cards………………..

Interestingly there has been no mention of Ryan and Stansted in this discussion.

[TominScotland]

Good discussion, this, as I guess all of us have experienced problems, both of our own making and because of airport security systems.

In fairness to, in particular, the LCAs, they do state very clearly on boarding passes and elsewhere, that gates will close 30 minutes prior to scheduled departure and that it is the passenger’s responsibility to be there on time. However, even that does not always guarantee a seat on the plane! A sad tale recently of waiting in the area of the ‘C’ gates at Dublin airport – for those of you who know Dublin, these are the gates after what we call ‘the Long March’. An FR flight to somewhere east of the Danube boarded across the way from us, gate closed and no announcement by name for missing pax. This left a lone girl fast asleep by the gate who then woke up to realise that her plane was (by this time) literally pushing back. All the screams and sobs in the world failed to move the gate staff and there she was, having to rebook and pay for a seat on tomorrow’s flight. The moral of the story? Get yourself to the gate on time AND stay awake because nobody else will look out for you.

[JonathanCohen09]

Hello KeaneJohn,

you make a good point. In the event of a technical problem or cancellation I wouold expect the airline to make alternative arrangements for me as the problem, in the event of either of the events you mention, is definitely down to the airline.

I was making the point that I will always make sure that I am not in any way responsible for missing a flight.

On this occassion, in the event of a tech/cancellation problem, my fall back is a more expensive lunchtime departure from LHR which hopefully I will not need to use. My client is paying for the trip and will pay for the back-up if necessary. They would not however be very happy to pay if the fault were mine whether directly or indirectly by not allowing enough time to get to and then through the airport in good time for the flight.

A good bank holiday weekend to you all.

Cheers,

JC

[RCinBelper]

Greetings from Aus
I am a regular flyer on Qantas domestic, in particular to/from MEL and BNE. No problems here!
RC

[canucklad]

Hello fellow travellers

A few points to make……………

Firstly to the people who agree on arriving 2 hours (in plenty time) to chill at the gate in a relaxed frame of mind ……… most of us fly on business ,as a neccessity and as such are dictated to by work schedules, time being money etc ….. e.g. I leave my work in West London @ 5ish and could easily make my flight through T1, checking luggage and with a stop in the lounge in plenty time for my 6.30 flight to EDI

What threatens this is the following

1) The total non-sensical , unexplained ( for domestic & Eire passengers only) photographing & matching photos to Boarding cards on either side of the main security check ——– especially when they drag you back to the start of the process because their system has not captured muy ugly mug….. and i go through LHR almost evry week at the same time !!!!! or the que stops because it happens to some poor old granny who struggles to remember her name never mind answering questions about aphoto she couldn’t remember being taken!!! Why doesn’t this happen at EDI

2) Travellers who insist on being totally selfish and insist on carrying all their worldly possesions with them onto the aircraft …..like a “bag lady” all thats missing is the rusty shopping trolley and the moggy cat …..All i want is a seperate line for those of us with the common sense to travel with just the clothes on our back !!!

Oh—and if this sounds like you–I dont want your excessive baggage crammed under my seat—you deal with it

3) Security staff who seem to have no other role than to stand “gawklessly” around their colleagues staring at empty scanners and muttering loudly about how we (as passengers) should be thankful and more patient

I COULD GO ON………

One tip though……I mostly always check my small (could carry on) bag in….that way if I am held back…..they will be more likely to make the effort to wait and find me

Finally…….. Rest assured when I do travel on leisure I’m usually in loads of time (2-3 pints worth of time) —-After all who wants to miss their holiday flight

Have a great weekend

[IanFromHKG]

I just had a conversation with a colleague (American) shortly before reading this thread, about the trials and tribulations of transiting through DFW from an international to domestic flight (for more on mine and MartynSinclair’s past trials and tribulations, see http://www.businesstraveller.com/discussion/topic/Through-Baggage-Check– unfortunately I am going to have to do the same thing again later this month as no other connections were available). My colleague’s response was – write to Hillary Clinton (and she even sent me the contact details). I am going to do that. I will let you all know how I get on.

Who should one write to about the cases in this thread? Frankly, I don’t think the airlines are going to take responsibility. I also don’t think it is true to say that they subcontract the security work – they may collect the fee, but that no more makes them responsible for delivering the service than a shop collecting VAT is responsible for performance by our dear friends at HM Revenue & Customs. No – write to the airport operators. Make the point about lost revenue to their tenants, unwillingness to use that airport again for time-critical business meetings resulting in further lost revenue, not to mention bad publicity on fora such as this. And let us know what replies you get…

[RichHI1]

Whilst I have not needed to expedite security at LHR as I always overallow time due to M25 traffic problem issues, I can advise members that I and US colleagues have frequently had issues with time available to clear security at DFW, JFK, ORD (even using fast track) due to immigration delays and every time TSA have been very understanding and moved us through crew lanes to make flight. Rather then standing worrying or complaining in general, my experience has been in the US that a polite request to the TSA officials explaining the situation and the ikelihood of missing flights will normally produce a good result for you. (that said if you just cut it fine and turn up too late, don’t expect sympathy if you hit a snag).

[TJHOLDEN2]

Hi Jim
This happened to me at LHR T5 I arrived on time to check in but as I approached the security lane the bar code reader could not read the bar code on my boarding pass, I was sent back to have a boarding card re-issued which also couldn’t be read.
After a total of 6 boarding passes being printed and a sprint the length of T5 it was now impossible that I made it through security and to the gate in time resulting in me missing my flight to Boston.
However British Airways did take full responsibility and got me on the next available flight.

[andyarty]

I had a very similar situation to this. It was however a no frills airline but still! I was flying from Gdansk in Poland to Leeds. We arrived at the airport in excellent time but the whole terminal was evacuated before we could get through security. As a consequence we were only allowed back into the airport 10 minutes before the departure time. The airport didnt announce that the flight was delayed but the screen also didnt show any delay or even a gate number. Due to the fact that even the escalators were not working when we were allowed back in i assumed, (wrongly) that the flight would have been delayed. Security was a major issue to get through and in the end the gate closed leaving 9 passengers behind!
Although it was an electronic check in the airline were aware of the evacuation but it seemed as if they just wouldnt miss thier time slot!

I think that the airline are trying to wriggle out of this but in my opinion they were aware of the problem and they should have left reasonable time for all passengers to get to the aircraft, if they threw out thier schedule then so be it!

I will take this further however and will try to update if i can.

[ivornomates]

amazed you have so much time on your hands and even think of chasing this, the airline left on time – no argument, they dont count people not been at the gate on time regardless of circumstances a valid excuse for missing the flight, its not their problem

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