[VintageKrug]

Good points, Mr Pollack.

Having not turned right for a decade, I flew Premium Economy but three years ago, despite being able to upgrade with miles, so feel your pain (though I actually rather enjoyed it!).

There’s certainly something to be said for those used to turning left, making a point of turning right once in a while just to remind ourselves that gripes about the size of bubbles in F’s champagne are not always that relevant!

[K1ngston]

Thanks for your points VK, I hope we get to travel on the same plane in the future, I am the one standing the other side of the curtain with my hand out saying ” Please sir can I have some more?”

I didnt realise the champagne had bubbles … go figure!!!!!

[SwissExPat]

I posted up a few months ago on the subject of what are the the criteria for one travelling in J as opposed to Y (limit this to say 5h+ flights) and general response was really that it was up to who was paying etc.

I may be tempting my own fate but if I would really struggle if I was forced to conform to a Y only travel policy…. Actually it would be a deal breaker for me. IF I was changing jobs and a new employer informed me that a Y only policy was in place, that would be the end of the conversation (unless I could buy my own travel and the cost of this was factored into the overall compensation plan which would be unlikely if it was a large company)

In the extreme, hypothetically, If airlines only offered Y, then I would never consider a career which involved long haul travel (such as I have now)

Any others feel differently?

[Cedric_Statherby]

SwissExPat

I agree with you on every point. My company do still believe in J class travel on business trips over a certain length of time (6-7 hours I think not 5, but they are flexible for overnight trips) – there is a reason it is called business class and the only alternative is to demand to spend an extra night the far end recovering if one travels Y. At my age one can just about pursue that line with a straight face too!

For leisure flights I make it a rule to try not to fly business, because I am not “on business”. Economy is fine for short haul, and for the rare long-haul holiday flight I fly F. It is what all those FFP miles are for, and upgrades are often not that hard to find even when full FFP reward flights are sold out. Even with BA …

[VintageKrug]

I just don’t think flying more than 5 hours in economy is acceptable for business travel (unless, possibly in the charitable, some government and non-essential business – e.g. training).

Overnight, it’s completely unacceptable, unless you’re allowed a day to recover afterwards.

[SimonS1]

It may be unacceptable, on the other hand for many companies these days budgets have to be cut and many people would rather fly economy and have a job.

I’m doing more and more trips to the ME in economy for that reason, for a 6.5 hour daytime flight I just don’t feel the cost can be justified regardless of what my company does.

Plus it certainly doesn’t take me a day to recover, I arrive in the evening and start work the next morning.

[K1ngston]

Absolutely SimonS1 we would all like to go back to the heady days of J class travel, but sadly they have gone and the fact I still have my job is more important than complaining about it.

I have to say the companies that have changed their whole policy to Economy is fine what grips my shit is when a VP who will travel on the same flight as you turns left and you have to turn right that is the hardest thing to bear!

I must say 6.5 hours is a stroll in the park and does not really test the resolve, a 12.5 hour flight to Singapore and then followed immediately by a 9 hour flight to Sydney or indeed a 11 hour flight to Auckland that does and yes if I have to I will also get up the following morning to work! Its not ideal but thats what there is, it beats joining the ranks of the unemployed

[VintageKrug]

Indeed, I think day flights should also be added to the list of reasons why non-business class travel might be OK, but I’d still assert Premium Economy is necessary, if only to give some space to work, powerpoints and a more restful environment. Nothing worse than a flight where some obese, chatty BO monster is pouring over folds of fat into your space; at least this is less likely in PE.

I have myself bought exEU and Premium Economy fares to reduce costs in current circumstances, though I’ve always been able to upgrade using avios or onbusiness points as I do struggle to justify charging a nominal £2500 rtn for a trip, though of course corporate deals do reduce the cost considerably.

I’m not entirely certain the phrase “grips my shit” is appropriate language for the forum, though I do think it’s hilarious and not one I’ve heard before. I have set my team a challenge each to insert this phrase into discussions during the course of today; we will see how successful this is!

Perhaps it should be the code-phrase for the upcoming forum members meeting! 😉

[TimFitzgeraldTC]

It has probably been mentioned but 2 things I do (mostly for clients, but also myself).

If booking Economy and able to allocate seat without charge then I’ll allocate an aisle in the middle section (less chance of having to move for others on a 3-3-3 configuration or 3-4-3 than being on an aisle with a window (Obviously if I know they want window I give them window!!).

Something I have done for myself is be almost the last person to board. This way you can ask the person checking the coupons if they can bring up a seat map in case there have been last minute movements. By doing this I was able to get a Row of 3 to myself for a Gatwick to Mauritius flights as 2 people decided to upgrade to World Traveller Plus (turned out to be 2 colleagues). I then get “Business” Economy – 3 seats I could lie flat across and had a better sleep than my colleagues who had upgraded to WTP.

Always worth joining FFP schemes if doing a longhaul trip – a must. If the occasional European trip so not crucial but still worth it.

Like the point on paying up to a full economy fare – if that gets you premium or business then go with it. Yesterday I had a client book LON-Phuket for last night. Thai out Business back economy was only £150 more than BA Economy both ways so they made the sensible decision to go with Thai. So always worth checking the cost of upgrading when you buy a ticket from the start (Sometimes as in the case of BA to Delhi if you booked yesterday for December) Club was £400 cheaper return than Premium. Would have more for different dates.

Another thing but frowned upon by airlines. If 2 of you are travelling you can always book an aisle and window seats in the 3 (if applicable). If someone does sit in the middle then I’m sure they would be happy to have window or aisle (give them the choice). Cheeky but might give you an extra seat.

[VintageKrug]

On flights where seating isn’t allocated, board first, sit at the back and affect a hacking cough.

Hey presto, Business Class space all to yourself!

[SimonS1]

SimonPollack – completely agree. Fortunately I work for a company where the CEO sets an example here and if he ever travels business we know it is because he is doing something critical.

The company policy does make reference to business class travel, in reality we are all sensible and few people actually use it. Whilst there is a comfort factor to J class I do find it possible to work in economy, also on Emirates from LGW, power and USB sockets are standard in economy unlike some other airlines.

[K1ngston]

SimonS1 – Dont you find travelling EK a bit like Easy Jet though?? Its their equivalent for the sub continent and for moving the masses!

The other issue is their product varies so much if you are flying out to DXB from the UK you get the USB and power sockets but when their is no competition on their Asian flights you get old stock and frankly thats not good!

I have been lucky to fly EK in Business and First please read an earlier post, but since then I get aggrieved at the way I am treated in Y, especially as a GCH…

Without wanting to repeat myself cannot beat SQ for their Y product especially on the 380 its a class above the rest … pun intended!

[HappytobeSilver]

I enjoy being able to fly in business class, even on short haul flights within Europe. I do though draw the line at paying to fly business to Paris or Amsterdam, but on a flight of 2 hours or more I tend to book in business. One of organisation that I work for though limits re-imbursement of business class to flights of 7 hours or more. Accordingly when travelling on shorter flights I pay for a restricted business ticket and am reimbursed the cost of an (often flexible) economy fare. When flying on leisure I use my miles to upgrade to the cabin that I would like to fly in or will if miles not available pay for a business class seat.

[VintageKrug]

It always puzzles me that many expenses policies focus on the class of travel, rather than the absolute cost of the journey.

Surely, the optimal situation is to minimise the cost while maximising the utility/comfort of the traveller?

[K1ngston]

VK you’d think that right? But no its on the class and I have come across some travel departments that will book non direct because its cheaper, thats where I draw the line and normally a simple “well you take that route then” suffices Its tough out there in the real world you know 🙂

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