Abusive passenger bans and database

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This topic contains 21 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  canucklad 29 Jul 2015
at 18:46
.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 22 total)

  • Anonymous

    MrMichael
    Participant

    Jet2 are attempting the prosecution of a passenger that was abusive on a flight to Spain. I wish Jet2 all the best, abusive and threatening passengers are a problem for us all and rightly Jet2 will not tolerate it and equally most other airlines won’t either.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-33565863

    They are also calling for an airline wide database so that people can be banned from all airlines thus protecting pax and crew from these yobs. However one word of caution is that it should be based on a conviction, or one day I can see the day us all getting banned because we pissed off one vindictive crew member who exaggerated to the extent a banning order was imposed.


    handbag
    Participant

    However one word of caution is that it should be based on a conviction, or one day I can see the day us all getting banned because we pissed off one vindictive crew member who exaggerated to the extent a banning order was imposed.

    With BA the above would not be possible. without going into too much detail, as I do not feel that I should, various points are allocated for different types of behaviour.

    The points triggered will dictate the action taken. Warning letter, temporary ban, permanent ban etc. are put in place when points achieved.

    If you are handcuffed, met by the police and then convicted. The points for this would automatically mean a ban.

    If you are verbally abuse , the points would be lower than if you were being physically abusive. If however, there were numerous flights when different Crew had had to report a passenger for being verbally abusive, then the points would accumulate and this would show in the system and would be taken into account towards what action is taken.

    There is a formula to how it is worked out.

    I personally would like to see a worldwide data base with all airlines working to the same criteria.


    JohnnyEnglish
    Participant

    I agree in principle with debarring abusive passengers, but OP is right about vindictive crew.

    Leading from handbag’s response, perhaps the answer is that the airline industry also score points for rude/abusive cabin crew, with too many leading to warning letter, temporary suspension, dismissal, etc…


    handbag
    Participant

    JohnnyEnglish – 20/07/2015 08:50 BST
    Unfortunately passengers being rude is just an accepted part of every day life for Crew members as is passengers being polite. Being abusive to Crew or anyone else regardless of the situation is totally unacceptable. Their is a big difference and the two are not in the same category and are therefore looked at differently.

    I was trying to be informative, but I will not however be posting anything further on this matter, as I feel comments like are being made to use controversy, rather than a reasonable discussion.


    JohnnyEnglish
    Participant

    handbag – I am sorry you feel that way. My intent was to invoke discussion on how to avoid passenger bans from vindictive crew. A two-way system would go some way to achieving that.


    Charles-P
    Participant

    Controversial I know but let me go wading in anyway.

    I think we are rapidly developing a society where causing any form of offence is close to criminal activity and I think that is both unrealistic and unwanted. The right to cause offence and to be obnoxious is as much a human right in my view as the others we all defend. If somebody is acting like a prat then why can’t I call them that ?
    Why are immigration officers so precious and delicate that they can’t hear the odd swear word ?
    If a crew member is being an obnoxious bitch why should I have to live with it because the alternative is to face a future ban from an airline ?

    When did we all become such a bunch of wimps ?


    handbag
    Participant

    A passenger ban from a vindictive Crew member is a 100% impossible. Passengers do not get banned for being rude. I was a Disruptive Passenger Trainer for many years and I know that it is exceedingly difficult to get a ban – criteria has to be met.

    There is a department that deals with all the reports that go in and make decisions. Crew have no say in what action is taken and are not aware if previous Crew have written in. If I write in, I may be the first or the 10th. I would be totally unaware of any background or pattern to the pax. Fortunately the department where I send there report does, and they would know if the situations a one off or not. Warning letters, bans etc, are not taken likely. BA want your business.


    handbag
    Participant

    Charles-P – 20/07/2015 09:18 BST

    a crew member is being an obnoxious bitch why should I have to live with it because the alternative is to face a future ban from an airline

    If someone is being obnoxious , of course you should not have to accept it. Should you be abusive NO. If you were obnoxious back, would you get a ban NO. Are there ways to deal with people who are obnoxious to you, rather than being obnoxious back YES

    PEOPLE DO NOT GET BANNED FOR BEING OBNOXIOUS.
    They get banned for endangering the safety of the aircraft, passengers or Crew.

    Johnny English had asked that I continue this discussion. Unfortunately, as I now feel that farcical comments are being made about passengers being banned for being obnoxious, I am wasting my time on trying to have a sensible discussion.

    I don’t know how I could have made it any clearer that Banning is a last resort for extreme dangerous behaviour. Not because someone is rude on a regular basis.


    Charles-P
    Participant

    handbag – I fully understand that people do not get banned from airlines for simply being rude.

    I was trying to make a point about the general level of discourse in society seeking to be controlled by some who seem to think they can legislate against offence.


    LuganoPirate
    Participant

    Our PC society today seems so heavily slanted towards the UK, where you have to be so careful what you write or say as it can be a career changing matter with apologies being demanded and so on. I enjoy engaging with the crew and sometimes I feel they are being a bit flirty so I reciprocate. However sometimes you feel they’ve had a bad day so it’s head down and read or play Two Dots until arrival.

    I don’t think anyone should be rude, abusive or use bad language and should certainly not use threatening behavior, but I sometimes wonder if the difference is not made between some psychopath and someone whose just had to much to drink. Not that that is an excuse but haven’t we all said or done something we regret after a tipple or two too many?

    For some reason most of these incidents seem to occur on the LCC’s or perhaps they’re the most reported and I wonder if there is a correlation between cheap flights, cheap booze and cheap accommodation, or am I stating the obvious?


    MrMichael
    Participant

    I am reassured by Handbag that a ban cannot come in due to one or two vindictive crew. My concern in the original post was regarding a database all airlines use to be able to ban from all airlines, not just the one the person was abusive on. I did not know as Handbag kindly explained that staff kept records and did not take action on one incident, unless it ended up a Police matter.

    I think a good point was made by CharlesP, we have the right to be obnoxious if we wish ( I hope I am not) but not personally abusive and certainly not threatening. I think also cultural differences can come in to it personal space is a good example. As an Englishman I have my idea of my personal space and how that can be invaded, the same for a Chinese person is different, their personal space is half of ours. This a Chinese person complaining for instance (while stood) will likely stand closer than I might be comfortable with. If I did not know of the cultural difference I might find that intimidating, while the Chinese person meant no such thing.

    The scenario a couple of years ago was:- I was sat in Business on an IB flight LHR-MAD….the female cabin crew member was putting used trays in to the slots on the cart. One of them got stuck, right next to me in the aisle seat. She lost patience and pushed it really hard causing the half cup of orange juice to jump of the tray and on to my foot spilling juice on my shoe and trouser. I said words along the lines of “oh for Christs sake, do be careful”. She then in a loud voice informed me I was being abusive and may be banned from flying IB in future. I retorted to tell her to “go for it”. The bottom line is I was not banned, but did worry next few flights if I would actually get on the aiircraft.

    Handbag, please do contribute to the debate, nobody was trying to abuse you, it just gets lively on here with lots of views and opinions. Don’t ban yourself 🙂


    LuganoPirate
    Participant

    Rude check in staff quibbling sometimes over 500 grams of excess baggage even if partner is 3kgs under.

    Arrogant and inefficient security staff who scowl rather than smile.

    Lounge dragons who don’t know the rules but think they do and then become argumentative.

    Gate staff who couldn’t care less.
    Passport check by ex Stasi

    Crammed like sardines (at least in Economy) with an oft indifferent crew who are sometimes rude and see their mistake as your fault. Resulting in possible bans and being on databases.

    And we are the fare paying passenger that pays for all their salaries and benefits! Have we lost the plot somewhere?


    Charles-P
    Participant

    LuganoPirate – Very well said


    Charles-P
    Participant

    Flyerboy1 – that ‘wooshing’ noise you heard just now was the point just missing you.

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