[Anonymous]

[RichHI1]

Please can someone elighten me why the BA YQ Surcharge is counted as a tax? (I am not talking about UKAPD). I have been told today by AA and BA that for ticketing purposes the BA YQ surcharge on miles tickets is counted as a tax, so if you change flights on the same day on the same route on the same carrier they have to refund and recharge all the taxes at any increased rate.
YQ is not a tax but a surcharge imposed by BA and some other carriers (though many have scrapped them) to cover increased costs and protect margin and as such I cannot see legally how they can justify calling it a tax for ticketing purposes. Do BA account for this as Tax in their accounts?
If a hotel encountered an increase in employee social security payments and passed these on to guests as a tax, they would have difficulty collecting in court (although they can and do pass on as a price increase).
I find this practice of calling it a tax very dubious and indeed feel that nickel and diming with non transparent fantasy fares and extra hidden charges is something one would associate more with low cost low frills carriers rather than a national flag carrier.
Can someone explain to me why they can call it a tax? Thanks.

[craigwatson]

For all airlines the YQ is included in the tax calculations, if you notice BA and the others never call it a tax, its includes in “taxes, fees, and surcharges”

[RichHI1]

I was told this morning, “for ticketing purposes it is a tax” by BA and AA. My belief is as you state. I am intrigued to know if their accounts show it as tax or revenue.

[craigwatson]

i would imagine it would appear on their records as neither, but as a surcharge to offset increased operating costs

[craigwatson]

just going to to your original post, they dont call it a tax, they rightly call it a surcharge. for ticketing purposes it is dealt with/as the taxes. as with all airlines it is added in with the tax amount for collection purposes. if it was all broken down you would have a list of about 15 different charges and it would look like a reciept from the grocery store. as the “taxes” are made up of lots of fees that arent a tax, for example airport fees, security fees, airport improvement fees….. and so on, granted not all of these apply to all destinations, but some are duplicated like us security and uk security fees, only a very small ( relatively speaking) amount is an actual tax payable to the government.

[RichHI1]

I understood your point from the beginning. My view is that the IATA approved way fo applying surcharges as a tax is flawed. I agree with your point as any NY hotel bill will show with all the differring taxes.
It would be more transparent for IATA rules to specify Fare (with all the conversion rate stuff) surcharges and taxes. Surcharges being non governmental charges and taxes being governmental charges. I know it is not going to happen as changing the systems costs money and the airlines would not make anything out of it. I am just saying treating it as a tax on ticketing is wrong. Further I am not blaming BA or AA for this but IATA.

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

Rich

Cut and pasted from a comment I wrote on a another thread.

“As to airport taxes (what I call all the little extras added together), for BA MXP/LHR/AUH/LHR/MXP it comes to 458.52€.

For KM/EY MLA/LHR/AUH/LHR/MLA, only 77.35€, quite a difference, n’est ce pas?

Now if I book a separate ticket from LHR/AUH/LHR, taxes are £418 or approx. 470€ on that ticket alone.”

[FrequentTraveller]

Care needs to be taken when comparing real taxes, on different tickets.

For example the UK APD does not apply to through tickets where the journey starts outside of the UK and the connection at the UK airport is made within 24 hours of arrival.

[Binman62]

YQ is the fuel surcharge is I recall correctly. It went up some time ago. If you booked before the change you will have paid a lower rate of YQ. Any changes made after the increase in YQ will result in the new level of YQ being charged.

This would also apply to any taxes which had changed between the time of the original booking and the date of the change.

I am not defending BA’s position just setting out why it is so.

I think their fuel surcharge is now a matter for real concern. It has been in place too long and is now clearly part of the fare. It remains only because it allows BA to charge it on redemption tickets using miles that have already been subject to such surcharges. It is (IMHO) iniquitous

[craigwatson]

let me say from the start, i am not defending a fuel surcharge, just people seem to be linking fuel surcharge and BA, almost all airlines charge a fuel surcharge, there are only a handful out there that do not.

I for one think it should be included in the fare

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

FT

The two ex UK comparisons I made have connections of -24 hours in the UK.

[craigwatson]

disgusted – you cant just say the taxes on BA were xxxxx, and the taxes on ey were xxxx, so look at the difference, you also have to look at the fare plus taxes combined, after all the price your paying is not just the taxes alone.

a couple years ago JAL had a “special” to Australia for £45 return, looked great, but they had increased their taxes to £1000.

some airlines like EK, just put the industry accepted fuel charge element into their fare, so its not really fair to judge on taxes alone.

[RichHI1]

Craigwatson you are so right – Fares should be transparent.
The current situation is indefensible.
Although many airlines like American (except on BA metal) do not have surcharges it is not a BA issue so much as an IATA one.
The more we complain and make flight decisions to avoid it (as I did this morning) the more likelihood there is that things might change.
I have not seen one poster who says this is a good idea. Everyone seems to say be honest and tell us what we have to pay.
For me lounge access, movie choice, wines selection, seat preferences, whether you can wear pants at half mast etc etc are scondary. Honest transparent pricing is priority one.

[DisgustedofSwieqi]

Craig

“disgusted – you cant just say the taxes on BA were xxxxx, and the taxes on ey were xxxx, so look at the difference, you also have to look at the fare plus taxes combined, after all the price your paying is not just the taxes alone.”

Fair enough, I will right the wrong and publish the fares

British Airways 4,973 EUR

KM/EY -1,529 EUR

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