Singapore – ‘learn to live with COVID’.

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  • rferguson
    Participant

    Could you please point us to your reference for this. I have Google searched and cannot find it. Yes, the US has not approved the AZ vaccine for use in the USA, but I cannot find any official decision published that they will not accept the vaccination status of those who have been double jabbed with AZ, or for that matter other vaccines not yet approved for vaccination of US citizens.

    No COVID Vaccines have yet been FULLY approved by the US FDA for use. Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson have been given the go ahead due to the urgency of the pandemic and the benefit of vaccination outweighing the potential side effects. As Astrazeneca was not initially purchased for use by the US government they haven’t included it although I imagine in time with increased data, they will. I think this will occur sooner rather than later as the AZ vaccine has been quite widely used in neighbouring Canada.

    I don’t think it’s been published anywhere that the US WILL block visitors that have received the AZ vaccine from entering, more so that this is a hurdle in current negotiations with the UK.

    It did however stop some Bruce Springsteen fans attending the singers recent concerts in NYC. Fans had to present proof of Vaccination to enter. Anyone that had received AZ abroad were turned away. I think we will see a similar situation unfolding elsewhere soon enough. My aunt and uncle in Argentina were both very enthusiastic to be vaccinated as they are both quite elderly and the most common Vaccine available there is the Sputnik vaccine made by Russia. I doubt many western countries will accept that (or the Chinese one) for a while yet.

    https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/us-uk-travel-corridor-talks-increasingly-unlikely-conclude-end-july-ft-2021-06-28/

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/astrazeneca-vaccine-bruce-springsteen-on-broadway-concert-new-york-b941311.html

    5 users thanked author for this post.

    LaWhore
    Participant

    The latest data tells us that the vaccines provide more protection against the Delta variant (95-96%) than they do against the Kent variant (86-92%). Not sure this will go in line with Project Fear?


    RalphVale
    Participant

    We should be participant in vaccination program offer by countries’ Gov because it is only way to safe from Covid-19


    K1ngston
    Participant

    Very interested to hear your collective take on Singapores (overstated) success where vaccinations are concerned! My husband is a Government vaccinator and the process has been problematic and slow from the start. Lets be clear for a country of 5.4M people, only having 70% of the population vaccinated to date and very few of the older more vulnerable citizens is not great! The elder population have refused to be vaccinated which was the reason for this months further lockdowns (trying to protect the older generation!)

    The whole process has come across as confused and the more the Government tried to chase zero the harder it became and only now have they changed their stance and insisted you need to be vaccinated to enjoy greater privileges! For those of you following the news here, we had NO deaths for months and months and as soon as the message and narrative changed to one on encouraging the elder population to vaccinate, we have now seen 12 deaths this month all elder residents with underlining conditions as if to highlight the point!!!

    There are still very very confused messages coming out of the Government regarding travel, and as Martyn states whilst I can fly to the UK early September without quarantine I will have to endure 14 days upon my return even though I am fully vaccinated here in Singapore for the very reasonable cost of $2,300 SGD plus tests ….

    Apparently the best place to travel to Singapore from in now Germany, can someone please explain what they have done right to get this status, albeit if you have to spend 21 days in Germany before flying into Singapore without quarantine and just a test regime?

    The whole region held up as a beacon in the early days of Covid is now one big s$#t show, Thailand, Malaysia, Vietnam, Indonesia all with spiralling cases and closed borders, meaning it will be long time before Asia is open to business again, which of course is tragic for the holiday destinations in the region who have no tourists!

    6 users thanked author for this post.

    cwoodward
    Participant

    It would indeed look as though the vaccination program has not gone well in Singapore.

    From what I have read a very poor job was done in vaccinating the many low paid workers and helpers and this largely resulted in the 66,500 cases recorded against a population of 5.70 million. Hong Kong (to add context) has a population of some 7.50 million yet many fewer – some 12,000 – recorded cases.
    Both though are struggling to get their populations vaccinated, not through lack of effort by the respective authorities but partly because the older Chinese of both places are historically still very resistant to western medicine and because Singapore largely ignored the needs of the poor.
    Hong Kong has struggled to 60% vaccinated but that has been only after bribing the general populace with prizes of 10M$ apartments, Mercedes cars and the like. There is an expectation that with the government now insisting that its employees are jabbed and also now several other major employers are following suite that here we will get to 70%+ prior end September

    3 users thanked author for this post.

    K1ngston
    Participant

    You may have read of the “Vietnamese lady” who was granted a visa on the basis of “spousal conditions” who consequently infected a large amount of locals in the so called KTV bars ( brothels to you and me) and of course the problem was that people were unwilling to come forward so it was tough to trace until one infected person went to the Fisheries port and infected them there and of course we ended up with a cluster over time of 1000 plus!… Couldn’t make this sh#t up if you wanted……


    cwoodward
    Participant

    I always wondered what those KTV places were !


    K1ngston
    Participant

    Karaoke bars before Covid and then the Government changed the status from “Drinking Clubs” to “F&B” so the changes were instead of a “happy ending” over a whiskey it was over a ham sandwich 🙂 …..


    Inquisitive
    Participant

    It would indeed look as though the vaccination program has not gone well in Singapore.

    From what I have read a very poor job was done in vaccinating the many low paid workers and helpers and this largely resulted in the 66,500 cases recorded against a population of 5.70 million. Hong Kong (to add context) has a population of some 7.50 million yet many fewer – some 12,000 – recorded cases.
    Both though are struggling to get their populations vaccinated, not through lack of effort by the respective authorities but partly because the older Chinese of both places are historically still very resistant to western medicine and because Singapore largely ignored the needs of the poor.
    Hong Kong has struggled to 60% vaccinated but that has been only after bribing the general populace with prizes of 10M$ apartments, Mercedes cars and the like. There is an expectation that with the government now insisting that its employees are jabbed and also now several other major employers are following suite that here we will get to 70%+ prior end September

    I do not agree with the statement that vaccination program is not gone well in Singapore.
    Singapore is among very few countries where 70%+ population are fully vaccinated and that is free for citizens, PR and all long term employment pass holders. That is the number where experts are telling that herd immunity will happen. (Of course this virus is much more resilient with various versions so it is taking time.)

    The problem in Singapore is that some people – mostly older – are not willing to vaccinate, even they had the first preference and even now it is walk-in for almost everyone.

    One need to factor that Singapore was never really fully closed or locked down. The MRT system and busses never stopped. The factories, mainly continuous process industries never stopped. And all operators and maintenance people continue to work at site. And because many support workers live in dormitories, initially that was the main source of spreading. That was quickly contained.
    Singapore airlines never stopped flying to and from important airports although the passenger numbers were very low.

    Now the life is almost normal, the dining in is allowed, visitors allowed in football games, etc. There are a few cases daily but what I understand that vaccinated people those who are affected recovering quickly.

    I have friends and relatives in many countries including North America and Europe and hearing from them regarding various vaccination program in those countries, I feel very fortunate that at this time I live in Singapore.

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    cwoodward
    Participant

    It is pretty much irrefutable that Singapore did a poor job of vaccinating the migrant workers and that this is largely the reason why Singapore has had, with a considerably smaller population to date 6 times as many cases as has Hong Kong.
    Most of us here I suspect have friends, associates and relatives spread across the world and in many countries life has proceeded largely as normal but defiantly with richer well governed countries as are Singapore and Hong Kong fairing very much better than the large but poor Asian countries who were never going to be in a position to ride out this pandemic without severe difficulties and loss of life.

    I may well have missed it but I don’t recall reading that Singapore had donated much in the way of funds or vaccine to its poor neighbours
    Better perhaps not to crow about how good things are for us lucky few million and at least properly look after the migrant workers who given the chance would willingly have been vaccinated in early months in Singapore.

    It seems to me that it is no great achievement vaccinating 70% of a small elite population when money for vaccine and good hospital care is so readily at hand.

    3 users thanked author for this post.

    K1ngston
    Participant

    Absolutely agree with you cwoodward! Singapore has done a really poor job or dealing with the pandemic promising in the press that they would be the first to recognise COVID as endemic and then immediately proceeding to lock us down again time and time again. The messages have been confusing and don’t even get me started with the bureaucracy around the ever changing rules

    I do believe finally that Singapore has contributed to some of its poorer neighbours but I am sure the elitist here did that through gritted teeth!

    The tone was best set here a few weeks ago, when calling the second phase 2 realignment after having just opened us up again, they said that whilst people are still expected to stay at home the National Day Parade was going to take place! I think the backlash was swift and they postponed it the next day, and then for me the piece d resistance! They are going to allow maids to bypass the system so that the poor Singaporeans who have had to manage on their own were able to have maids to use and abuse again!

    Yes this is my home, I own a business here and I am married to a Singaporean who agrees with my sentiments totally, to be clear there are 5.4M people here run by an authoritarian government we should all have been vaccinated long ago except for medical reasons, and its a fact we are not! My husband is working in the vaccination programme so is totally aware of the process here!

    I mentioned it in my first comment, Asia was lauded as a the guiding light of leading us out of the COVID mess, as it stands today, unless you are prepared to wait 14 days in quarantine, or worse still not gain access do not bother planning to visit soon!

    2 users thanked author for this post.

    K1ngston
    Participant

    It would indeed look as though the vaccination program has not gone well in Singapore.

    From what I have read a very poor job was done in vaccinating the many low paid workers and helpers and this largely resulted in the 66,500 cases recorded against a population of 5.70 million. Hong Kong (to add context) has a population of some 7.50 million yet many fewer – some 12,000 – recorded cases.
    Both though are struggling to get their populations vaccinated, not through lack of effort by the respective authorities but partly because the older Chinese of both places are historically still very resistant to western medicine and because Singapore largely ignored the needs of the poor.
    Hong Kong has struggled to 60% vaccinated but that has been only after bribing the general populace with prizes of 10M$ apartments, Mercedes cars and the like. There is an expectation that with the government now insisting that its employees are jabbed and also now several other major employers are following suite that here we will get to 70%+ prior end September

    I do not agree with the statement that vaccination program is not gone well in Singapore.
    Singapore is among very few countries where 70%+ population are fully vaccinated and that is free for citizens, PR and all long term employment pass holders. That is the number where experts are telling that herd immunity will happen. (Of course this virus is much more resilient with various versions so it is taking time.)

    The problem in Singapore is that some people – mostly older – are not willing to vaccinate, even they had the first preference and even now it is walk-in for almost everyone.

    One need to factor that Singapore was never really fully closed or locked down. The MRT system and busses never stopped. The factories, mainly continuous process industries never stopped. And all operators and maintenance people continue to work at site. And because many support workers live in dormitories, initially that was the main source of spreading. That was quickly contained.
    Singapore airlines never stopped flying to and from important airports although the passenger numbers were very low.

    Now the life is almost normal, the dining in is allowed, visitors allowed in football games, etc. There are a few cases daily but what I understand that vaccinated people those who are affected recovering quickly.

    I have friends and relatives in many countries including North America and Europe and hearing from them regarding various vaccination program in those countries, I feel very fortunate that at this time I live in Singapore.

    Inquisitive, there are only 5m people here 70% of pop is nothing to be lauded about, it simply isn’t!


    MartynSinclair
    Participant

    Will Singapore be the first Asian country to open to the business and tourist world, without the prisoner style quarantine for ex-UK?


    K1ngston
    Participant

    I doubt it Martyn, you have to apply for permission even as a Long Term Pass Holder and then you have to undertake 14 days quarantine, unless you come from Germany (but you have to be in situ there for 21 days) and even then rules are prone to change!

    My up and coming trip where I am effectively free to travel throughout Europe, and vaccinated in Singapore with Pfizer I will have to quarantine in a facility for 14 days!

    Its the same across the whole of Asia currently!


    cwoodward
    Participant

    Hi Martin
    It will not in my opinion be the first or I suspect do it at all well, or for more than a few days before they rejig the process time and again.

    It is likely I feel that Hong Kong (with almost zero local cases since April and a vaccination rate close to 60% and now moving forward well and among all social classes) will be properly and importantly solidly open for business before Singapore who still suffer from frequent bouts of the virus irruptions as they have never dealt with the epidemic among the poorer of the populous properly which is pointed up the 111 cases recorded yesterday.
    Slick salesmen these Singaporeans – not sure about the warranty though.
    Areas of Thailand opened to tourists a few weeks back and the W clan are hoping to go to Koh Samui end September – about an even chance of happening – providing HK will let fully vaccinated residents back without quarantine.

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