[SimonS1]

@MrM – I don’t really follow there. You know it is against the airline’s SOP, or you are assuming this must be the case due to the pilot’s reaction?

People do react in strange ways sometimes when challenged and I don’t think filming is necessarily a good idea (in the same way that taking pictures in and around airports can cause issues). I’m just curious that after the Germanwings incident a number of airlines announced policy changes…Aegean was it one of them.

These things can be a matter of interpretation. Personally I would rather someone was able to access the cockpit in an emergency.

[MrMichael]

SimonS1, I don’t know, I just find the reaction of the pilot to being challenged the interesting part. If someone films someone doing nothing wrong then usually they are not too bothered about it. The pilot reacted badly, as if in my mind he was caught red handed doing something he should not have been doing. My interpretation is that him leaving the cockpit door open as he did was against Operating rules of the airline, he knew it, and tried to bluster out of it this making the whole situation worse.

If the door was open as described, then presumably two things could have occurred:-

1. The other pilot could have shut it to crash the aircraft if he was minded to do so.

2. AN Other could have accessed the cockpit for reasons not conducive to a safe flight. That could have been for terrorist, hijack purposes or some random nutcase that pops up on flights from time to time.

Both scenarios are highly unlikely, but rules are made to account for the highly unlikely. The unlikely does happen from time to time, and could, just could, have occurred on that flight, at that time.

[FDOS_UK]

I lived next door to a UK airline captain for 10 years.

I consulted to BA, for 1 year and met a number of their captains.

I also flew light aircraft for 15 years and encountered a number of airline captains, who also flew ‘lighties’.

They are very strong characters (for good reason) and the Aegean captain’s response is exactly what I would expect – the OP was lucky that A3 were on a quick turnaround at an airport where missing a slot gets very expensive, or he may well have called the police.

[MrMichael]

FDOS, called the Police for what?

[FDOS_UK]

Interfering with the crew in their lawful performance of their duties.

Look up the Tokyo convention.

[MrMichael]

How did he interfere, he just filmed/took photos, or have I missed something?

Edited to add:- Just looked the Tokyo Convention up, it pertains to jurisdiction when an offence is committed on a non domestic flight. I am figuring filming was not an offence ( from what I can tell) although could have been if it was during take off/landing when electronic equipment should not be used. The OP suggests that was not the case, and as the pilot was in the galley I sure hope not.

[FDOS_UK]

MrMichael – 08/05/2016 20:24 BST

The Tokyo Convention gives the aircraft commander authority to report a passenger and also the UK authorities the jurisdiction to prosecute.

The UK Air Navigation Order (2005), Article 78 prohibits every person in an aircraft from using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour or from behaving in a disorderly manner towards a member of the crew of the aircraft. It also makes it an offence for someone intentionally to interfere with the performance of duties by a member of the crew.

If the senior cabin crew member and the captain interpreted the OPs actions as being threatening or insulting or interfering with their duties, the captain could use his authority under the Tokyo Convention to have the police meet the aircraft on arrival – and the police would be at the gate, have no doubt.

Whether the Police would see this as an offence or whether CPS would prosecute is another matter, but being detained is a plausible scenario.

Ref: http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/p_to_r/road_traffic_offences_transport_offences/#aircraft

Let me make it very clear that I am not stating or implying that the OP committed an offence, but on the level of sharing knowledge in a friendly way, I would counsel fellow BT readers to be careful what you do in similar situations, as the powers available to aircraft commanders (in flight) are strong.

[MrMichael]

I agree FDOS, one should be careful, I have heard stories as I am sure we all have of people making justifiable complaints that have turned in to them being kicked off the aircraft. I cannot help thinking that some crew find a challenge from a pax so uncomfortable they exaggerate the whole thing to the extent of smoke and mirrors, and are then backed up by colleagues.

But I stand by my original argument, that the apparent actions of the pilot are at odds with a person that has nothing to hide.

[FDOS_UK]

MrMichael

Whether the Aegean crew over reacted or not (and I do not see how one can reasonably judge this, as we were not there), airline captains (in the air, on the ground is a different matter) have far reaching authority.

Here is an example of a captain deciding to overrule ATC at New York and they have to live with it and clear the way for his aircraft.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sQuHnrJu1I

As much as you interpret his behaviour as having something to hide, I can equally see that he could be furious at having his decision making criticised and could regard this as interfering with the performance of a crew member.

Edited: and there is also the matter of national culture, according to Hofstede’s research, Greece has a far higher Power-Distance index than the UK and thus people in senior positions will not necessarily tolerate questioning of their actions. Greece also has a far lower individualism index than the UK, meaning that people are expected to conform to norms more and the tolerance for ambiguity is very much lower in Greece, than in the UK, meaning that a UK captain might just shrug something off as being due to a passenger misunderstanding something, whereas a Greek captain may well wish to make it very clear that he is the boss and that is the end of the story.

May I ask if you have much experience of working cross culturally (i.e. outside the UK?) I have and cultural factors can have a significant impact in the way people behave.

I’ve quite a bit of experience working in Greece and would comment that they generally make good friends, but you wouldn’t want them as enemies.

[MrMichael]

FDOS, your right, he could well have been furious at his decision making being challenged. I am going by what the OP says happened, that’s all I can go on. We don’t have the captains side of things.

However challenging behaviour and asking for an action to be justified/clarified is not in my book interfering with the performance of a crew member. If the OP had said, “you must shut the door”, then yes, but he didn’t, he seems to have asked about it and filmed the incident.

[FDOS_UK]

Mr Michael

Have a look at the cultural comparisons I’ve just added to my post, above, it might help you see it from a broader perspective.

Here’s the source

https://geert-hofstede.com/greece.html

You can add the UK as a comparitor, by using the drop down menu, at the top of the page.

[TimFitzgeraldTC]

Either way – one must be wary of equations. By All account doing some “maths” onboard a plane is now suspicious!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-36240523

[FDOS_UK]

He didn’t just do equations, he did differential equations!

He should go straight to the slammer, for that 😉

[EU_Flyer]

Very interesting post.

I can understand the OP’s concern… however….

Having flown Aegean many times, I have always found them to be professional – almost to a fault. They are one of the best run companies in Greece.

If the flight deck door was left open whilst the crew were in the galley, this is not at all unusual and certainly not against Aegean’s SOP – I would safely presume. From my experience, they place a small trolley in the way of the door.

If free access to the forward left toilet was allowed at this time, I’d find that very strange as Aegean have always been strict with forward toilet access when door is open in my experience. Like the OP I would have been concerned and politely raised it with the crew – but not filmed it.

As for the Captain’s reaction. Nobody likes to be filmed without their consent. To spring this on a pilot – in the current environment – would be startling and I can understand why the Captain was upset. Was he over-reacting due to guilt? Perhaps yes, or perhaps no.

But on things like aircraft security, I know enough to know that it’s none of my business to meddle in the affairs of crew especially where I don’t know what’s going on. Different if it it’s another passenger.

[FDOS_UK]

“But on things like aircraft security, I know enough to know that it’s none of my business to meddle in the affairs of crew especially where I don’t know what’s going on. “

Wise words, otherwise you risk them thinking you are interfering with the performance of their duties.

[Author]

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