My wife is stuck at CDG!

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This topic contains 32 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  SimonS1 6 Jul 2018
at 09:32
.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 33 total)

  • DanielRawson
    Participant

    May I ask for advice please?

    My wife flew out on Sunday to Sicily from MAN via AMS and was due to return to MAN via CDG. Flight was booked through KLM but the returns were on the same reservation but with Air France.

    I will be brief to prevent interest being lost!

    Flight out all OK
    Return flight today from Sicily to CDG delayed on the stand for 1 hour due to wind? I’ve checked and other flights at the same time went off on time. Due to aircraft going to remote stand and being bused at CDG she couldn’t get connection. Crew knew people had connections but showed no interest.

    No further flights today. Told the hotel they use is full and she can claim €120 and find her own and was refused further help. No hotels for miles so she is sleeping in the airport. They provided a blanket.

    It goes without saying (I hope) this is not how a fellow human being should be treated. Are Air France behaving ethically or are they running from their responsibilities? Should any issue be taken up with KLM as the ticket was booked with them or does it not matter as they are the same entity?

    Thank you


    openfly
    Participant

    A lesson to us all, avoid AF like the plague!


    capetonianm
    Participant

    Not trying to defend AF – far be it from me to do that!

    She is obviously entitled to a hotel but if there are none available and they’ve tried all options (it doesn’t sound as if they have tried very hard) then I’m not sure what they can do apart from offer her reimbursement. €120 is pretty stingy for Paris at the end of June!

    I hope she recovers from what was probably a most unpleasant night and doesn’t have to travel on AF again.

    1 user thanked author for this post.

    canucklad
    Participant

    Morning Daniel
    It Seems that your wife is just the latest victim of that double whammy , CDG design & AF’s culture of indifference !!
    It’s a similar feeling to having your face slapped with a wet fish, in this case a very wet French fish…….

    I landed early at CDG, but for reasons known only to AF/.CDG we taxied, and taxied, and taxied some more until we eventually parked up somewhere in Luxembourg!! Then had a pleasant plane spotters bus tour back to the terminal.

    Alas, even with the 30 minute early arrival, we missed our connection !!

    To be fair,, there was one young lassie from AF who met us and tried her best with the connecting passengers. Sadly securities indifference and her own colleagues laissez faire attitude meant she was always on a loser !
    Eventually one member of ground staff rudely gave us an option to route home via Schiphol ,buts the rest of my travelling party elected to spend the next 8 hours at CDG, not wanting to take chances with luggage getting lost or anything else possibly going wrong !

    When asked if we were entitled to vouchers ……. I was met with a glare that would stop a charging buffalo !!

    AF’s attitude to connections, is very much that it’s the passengers responsibility to be at the departure gate at the designated time ……
    When I pointed out that we arrived on an AF plane, then where transferred on an AF bus and then where escorted through the terminals with an AF employee, they metaphorically with Gallic indifference shrugged their shoulders and waved me aside . And I was trying my best to communicate in my best ( albeit rusty) French Canadian ……

    So my advice to you, put it down to experience, try and avoid CDG / AF , grab the 120n Euro’s and the next time you’re in Europe have a slap up meal .

    I’d still chase the EU261 claim, and if it makes you feel any better I’d also send a letter of complaint to both CEO’s……

    It’ll be interesting to see what replies you get back from the entity that is AF/ KLM .

    As an aside, it’s a shame, because I actually find AF staff vert good in the air , but then maybe that’s just because you’ve experienced a less than satisfactory experience at CDG !!

    3 users thanked author for this post.

    capetonianm
    Participant

    I too found AF good in the air and diabolical on the ground. All of the negative perceptions that one has about lousy French customer ‘service’, indifference, and arrogance are proved by the way AF treat passengers on the ground.

    I came back from BKK on AF (C class) once and the inhouse travel idiots booked me a 45 minute connection for an onward flight, which was the theoeretical MCT. I changed it to a later one, with almost 2 hours, and missed that because of the queues and couldn’t care less attitude. When I went to the AF counter to change the flight the woman said to me :
    “You’ve missed your flight”, with, as Canucklad said a glare that would stop a charging buffalo , as if it was my fault for being a naughty boy and :” You’ll have to buy a new ticket as this one is not changeable” which was utter BS. I stood my ground and eventually she put me on another flight.

    1 user thanked author for this post.

    LuganoPirate
    Participant

    My saying don’t fly AF and avoid CDG like the plague, as I do, will not really help Daniel, but maybe a lesson for the future. I’ve so often noticed that when booking KLM to get a good fare on the return leg it’s necessary to fly AF back, but paying a bit more gets you KLM metal. Perhaps it’s the only way AF can get any business??

    As others have said, take the €120 and put it down to experience. However, I would try and insist they put me on another flight via AMS or London perhaps if that gets you home quicker. It’s not a British thing to do, and hence Capetonians success (no offence meant Capetonian), but treat them as they do you. No point being nice and smiling, be firm and as arrogant as they are. The French usually respect that much more and as always, in the face of an onslaught quickly surrender. (I’ll likely be reported for stereotyping here, but just telling the truth 😉 )

    And do go for the EU261, not sure how much, I think it’s €300 either by using a claim service and if that fails the small claims court as you bought the ticket in the UK.
    Let us know how you got on.

    1 user thanked author for this post.

    GivingupBA
    Participant

    She is obviously entitled to a hotel but if there are none available and they’ve tried all options (it doesn’t sound as if they have tried very hard) then I’m not sure what they can do apart from offer her reimbursement. €120 is pretty stingy for Paris at the end of June!.

    But Daniel said “Told the hotel they use is full and she can claim €120 and find her own and was refused further help” – based on that, it looks like they didn’t explore any other options at all apart from that one hotel.

    Daniel, very sorry to hear about your difficulties – it sounds like very poor service to me. I would be absolutely hopping mad if my wife had to sleep in the airport.

    I’ve said it before – my policy is to avoid AF, and avoid CDG.

    1 user thanked author for this post.

    Edski777
    Participant

    My initial thought was: Lucky you!, but you seem to want her back. 😉
    I do agree with LuganoPirate: avoid AF and CDG at all cost. (Easy for me to say as I am now based in Amsterdam)

    So in that case get on social media (facebook, twitter) right away to KLM. They usually respond very quickly, seem to be operating 24/7 and are quite good in resolving your problems. AF at CDG are beyond useless. Avoid contacting AF unless your command of the French language is on par with a native Frenchman.

    Lodge a complaint with KLM based on EU261 via their website and they will typically come back to you within 48 hours and if you have a reasonable claim resolve the matter within a week or so.
    Normally absolutely no need for a claim service yet, KLM is quite fair.


    SimonS1
    Participant

    Lodge a complaint with KLM based on EU261 via their website and they will typically come back to you within 48 hours and if you have a reasonable claim resolve the matter within a week or so.

    Normally absolutely no need for a claim service yet, KLM is quite fair.

    This is incorrect advice, EC261 is the responsibility of the operating airline not the ticketing airline and the OP’s wife was travelling with AF.

    The €120 is only advisory. Ultimately AF are liable for the cost of the hotel and if Paris is busy/€500 is the going rate (which if there were “no hotels for miles” may have been the case) then that is what they have to pay. However you are past that point now.

    Log your EC261 claim with AF. If they don’t play ball then Bott & Co are very good but at a cost.


    DanielRawson
    Participant

    Thank you for your views so far. My wife has now arrived home which is positive. (I think 😉 ) I will let you know how we get on. All advice in the meantime is of course still appreciated.


    Nogbad01
    Participant

    canucklad wrote:

    I landed early at CDG, but for reasons known only to AF/.CDG we taxied, and taxied, and taxied some more until we eventually parked up somewhere in Luxembourg!! Then had a pleasant plane spotters bus tour back to the terminal.

    Same thing happened to me a few years back. Plane arrived on time and with 1.5 hrs should have had plenty of time for transfer.

    Nope. Missed the connection. Only option. Wait 8 hours and go home.

    Guess which airport I never use now!


    MarcusGB
    Participant

    I agree, if booked with KLM,. they will be fair, reasonable, and come back sharpish. they tend to tell you what your rights are, as postered all over Schiphol Airport.
    Having travelled KLM for over 25 years, i rarely encounter any problems they do not manage, and if there are probl;ems, they rectify as much as they can, and inform you before you ask. They problem solve. AF will avoid you, show complete arrogance, and an inept attitude.

    However, i would not even book AF anywhere these days, with the attitudes and lack of reliability, and frankly, the whole future of the Airline in the balance.
    They are a complete opposite, and a shame to KLM, that makes all the profit, and expands and holds great Brand strength Worldwide, unlike AF.

    Simple , DO NOT travel Air France in the coming periods, even booking this year, until their staff disputes, behaviour and future are set clear. If ever…


    Edski777
    Participant

    SimonS1, you would be correct in stating that AF is the operating airline, but I consider AF/KL to be one organization. And in my experience KLM won’t let you down once you book through them and get stuck with AF. Especially under the circumstances that AF is in at the moment I would rely on KLM. If they won’t handle it they will inform you straight away and advise you of your rights and the best route to follow.

    Whatever happens when you lodge a complaint with AF is anybody’s guess.


    capetonianm
    Participant

    REGULATION (EC) No 261/2004 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL
    of 11 February 2004
    establishing common rules on compensation and assistance to passengers in the event of denied
    boarding and of cancellation or long delay of flights, and repealing Regulation (EEC) No 295/91
    Paragraph 7

    In order to ensure the effective application of this Regulation, the obligations that it creates should rest with the operating air carrier who performs or intends to perform a flight, whether with owned aircraft, under dry
    or wet lease, or on any other basis

    Unfortunately she will have to claim from AF, as the operating carrier.


    OneA
    Participant

    There is an uncanny similarity here between AIR France and AER (sic) Lingus. Indifference of ground staff at home base, spurious cancellations at a whim when other airlines continue to fly, extreme attempts to avoid EU261, inability to run on time and indifference in getting passengers connected! Message is avoid any airline beginning with “air” !
    Never mind soon they can rot in their own union and Cruz can concentrate on wrecking Iberia, Walsh can go back to Aer Lingus and we can have a UK ceo for BA who has actually reached top tier on an international airline in the recent past, by actually flying with them!
    Whats that round pink animal flying through the air oinking?!!

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