[AllOverTheGaff]

Scott – what a useless contribution to an interesting debate.

[flying_cookie]

I am London based and my main criteria for choosing airline and hub (when possible) are first type of business class seat, then fare (not just how low, but also how flexible). I have a slight preference for OW or *A flights as I am top tier BAEC and M&M, but would travel DL when fare very attractive on an aircraft equipped with the proper flat beds.

Having explained my background, here’s my verdict…

Going West I am quite happy with BA, whose main issues are a bit of inconsistency and poor hot food. However, I get bumped to First so frequently that I have become a bit biased in favour, plus flying to continental Europe to then cross the Atlantic is a bit of a waste of time, even with cheaper fare. There are two routes where I have better options than BA: LAX, where my absolutely favourite option is NZ, whose Business Premier product is delightful and a lot of fun. And to JFK AA or DL are ok, the flight is short anyway. UA has a decent seat, but the experience is poor overall, though I’ve chosen them a couple of times when the fare was ridiculously low.

Now, to me, the issue of connecting in Europe is mostly related to flights going East. I dislike LH and AF/KL for the uncomfortable seats. FRA has improved a lot recently, but CDG is dreadful. AMS is ok, but since KL hasn’t to date been a possible option given their old style seat, I cannot comment about connecting there. Bottom-line, my favourite hub in Europe for long-haul connections is ZRH, especially with the new pier where the London flights dock – and most importantly because LX has in my opinion the best Business Class product on the Continent (at least until now). On ZRH-SIN I have frequently travelled on SQ metal as LX codeshare, for a fraction of the cost of the direct LHR-SIN with SQ. On occasion I fly CX, SQ or NH out of LHR, otherwise going East LX and ZRH are the only non-direct options I happily consider.

Truth is, I think there is no universal answer to the question what is the best hub/business product in Europe, as one’s location (for instance like me being so close to one of the hubs) is a key factor.

Finally, I do agree with those who argue that EK and its extensive network in Europe should be considered as one of the options for going East, but I am not in love with DXB as a hub, I find it too chaotic.

[Flyboy18]

AOTG….not really. Your constantly putting BA down, and that’s your opinion. And maybe rightly so but its just getting very repetitive.

Cookie…must say a very good post.

[FormerlyDoS]

“And maybe rightly so but its just getting very repetitive.

As is your habit of sniping at anyone who criticizes BA.

[AllOverTheGaff]

@scott72 – 04/08/2013 14:52 GMT

Perhaps you’d do well to consider your own input and contributions to the forum (or lack thereof) before critiquing anyone else’s.

[AllOverTheGaff]

flying_cookie – 04/08/2013 14:40 GMT
Truth is, I think there is no universal answer to the question what is the best hub/business product in Europe, as one’s location (for instance like me being so close to one of the hubs) is a key factor.

Agree with almost all of your post flying_cookie, and as EK serve me from Glasgow I am happy to use them wherever I am going Eastward.

BA used to get most of my West business because of their excellent schedules to almost all US major cities, I also did a lot of flying with VS whose upper class a few years back was something really special. But like you, I’ve also used UA a lot as they fly me directly to EWR from EDI and whilst it isn’t particularly special, it is normally cheap and in my opinion, on a par with what I expect from BA.

The discussion began with Swiss indicating why BA and LHR was their airline and hub of choice, I’ve given my opinions why BA and LHR are not my airline and hub of choice, nevertheless, I do agree that there are many factors which contribute to a purchase of an airline ticket.

[Swissdiver]

@cookie: the big difference between you and me is I do not have a hub nearby… That said I tend to agree with what you wrote although I favour BA to LX, notably because of the B747 upper-deck.

[Swissdiver]

@AOTG: to be or not to be a slave of a program… I tend to have a pragmatic approach. What counts for me is lounge access and fast lane security check when travelling in Europe (i.e. in Eco most of the time). Once this is done, I then favour one program that is currently BAEC. That said, it is only one criteria and it is usually not the main one.

[LuganoPirate]

Personally I enjoy the lounges and they’re an important part of my travel. More so than the plane ride itself. I’ll typically arrive 3 hours before departure, head straight for the lounge, relax, download reading material, have dinner and read the newspaper. I rarely eat on board and I find eating at a proper table at a reasonable hour, allowing the food to digest, more enjoyable than trying to stuff three course into oneself at midnight.

Like CXD I’m fortunate to be able to travel in First but only choose this for night flights. Otherwise it’s business. I’m equally fortunate that I can sleep anywhere, anytime, without pills, no matter the seat or where seated, though obviously a wide comfortable seat is always appreciated, as is a friendly cabin crew.

To this end I find Swiss the most friendly. There’s an air of humanity about them so sadly lacking amongst crew of other carriers I find.

I also enjoy Zurich airport and rate it my favourite. While the F lounges in FRA are probably the best anywhere, the airport itself is awful. Crowded, hot, complicated and it takes forever getting from European arrivals to the Longhaul lounge. In thus avoid it like the plague. LHR and AMS I also dislike though in fairness I’ve yet to experience T5 on departure. Mrs. LP who has tells me that apart from security, it was pleasant but not exceptional. CDG has always been a big no no.

The other airport I enjoy is Malpensa. It’s a bit chaotic at times, lounges are so so (exception here are the QR and EK lounges) but if you can adapt to and cope with the Italian mentality they’re fine.

[IanFromHKG]

Swissdiver, your post seems to be predicated on the basis that you are connecting on the same airline (this isn’t a criticism, just an observation), and with the exception of flying_cookie no-one seems to have addressed the subject of codeshares – now I realise that this does complicate the picture somewhat, but judicious use of codeshares can make for very pleasant experiences. By way of example, I was having great trouble a few months ago getting a redemption seat in business from HKG to LHR, so I took CX to FRA and connected to a codeshare flight on BA. On arrival, the CX lounge (which operates as both arrival and departure lounge, interestingly) was but a couple of minutes walk from the arrival gate. The lounge itself was impressive for an outstation which doesn’t have a lot of CX flights, with good and spacious showers, some surprisingly good food, and which was also positioned an easy walk from the BA gates (albeit there was another security check inbetween). Altogether, one of the best connecting-flight experiences I have ever had, and one I would certainly repeat if there was again an issue with availability or even, frankly, if it made a significant difference to the price (or timing, if that was a major factor)

I have also recently connected onto codeshares through AMS (awful – crap lounges, need to pay for showers, have to walk miles), CDG (awful – admittedly I was changing terminals each time which really does seem to be unnecessarily hard and painful, although the AF lounge was pleasant and served *excellent* croissants!, but conversely had a huge queue for the showers so never got to use them)

I had always laboured under the delusion AMS was a great place to connect but I think that must apply only if coming from the UK regions! I was hugely unimpressed and would avoid it in favour of FRA.

In any event, though, in all these cases, one of the main drivers for me would be the long-haul carrier, not the short-haul one

[FormerlyDoS]

I’m flying MLA-ZRH-CPH this afternoon and am looking forward to a smooth transit, sadly don’t have much time to enjoy the Senator lounge between flights.

[Swissdiver]

Ian, you are right. That was not on purpose though. I guess it reflects the fact the most common routes I am flying on do not generally offer code sharing possibilities.

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