[transtraxman]

Posted today (4-7-16)on the BBC News website…..
“Legal action over UK MPs’ role in Brexit.”
“A law firm is taking action to ensure the formal process for the UK leaving thje EU is not triggered without an Act of Parliament”.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world/europe

“Can the Law Stop Brexit?”(BBC News 30-6-16)
Put simply and concisely this article explains the situation.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-uk-leaves-the-eu-36671629

[MartynSinclair]

Can somebody please remind the Germans that we are still in the EU and stop being bloody minded.

Currently stuck by a closed Passport control at Dusseldorf airport..

[JohnHarper]

Someone predicted to me yesterday that soon Mrs May will deal with EU issues personally with Mrs Merkel, Juncker will be kept out of it. Significant changes will be proposed and ultimately Germany will force them through. The four key freedoms will remain but freedom of movement will be altered so that it does not include a freedom to settle unless you can demonstrate that you have gainful employment – basically what Cameron agreed but it will be EU wide reaching.

There will be a scaling back on Brussels and for instance petty directives like the pending one on the power of vacuum cleaners will all fall by the wayside.

The reshaping will be back to the idea of a ‘Common Market’ but one that looks outwards for competitive opportunity rather than in to protect. There will be kicking and screaming particularly from the French who have a long ambition to live off German money but basically as the paymasters Britain and Germany will push it all through.

How realistic this is I don’t know but it does make interesting thinking.

ABBA.

[MartynSinclair]

I am wondering what will happen if the French throw out the UK border controls in Calais by the tunnel. Will thy then push all the “travellers” through the tunnel or will the tunnel close, even temporarily…?

[JohnHarper]

Martyn, I understand that what holds up the various people on the French side is the UK border presence. The French have no problem letting people out but they can’t get past British controls. If those controls are removed from the Pas de Calais region as the Mayor of Calais is demanding then there will be nothing to stop people traveling to the UK though of course the ferry and train operators will still have a duty to ensure that they only allow people to board their services if they can demonstrate a right of access to the UK – though how they will stop people en-masse will be another matter.

ABBA.

[LuganoPirate]

[quote quote=643016]I am wondering what will happen if the French throw out the UK border controls in Calais by the tunnel. Will thy then push all the “travellers” through the tunnel or will the tunnel close, even temporarily…?

[/quote]

It’s not in the French interest to abandon UK border controls at Calais as the French have reciprocal rights in the UK. Fully exercised at Channel Tunnel entrance but can’t remember if also exercised at Dover.

However if they do, the ferries/tunnel will introduce boarding cards and API checks as airlines do. No right to enter and they will not carry you as they will be subject to heavy fines as the airlines are currently. Couple this with the fact we can then just send them back since they should have applied for asylum in France. It’s not done now due to an unwritten understanding between the British and French but if the controls are dismantled and with a tougher PM/HS this is likely to happen and with no French border controls UK side there will be nothing to stop us doing so.

[LuganoPirate]

[quote quote=642785]Someone predicted to me yesterday that soon Mrs May will deal with EU issues personally with Mrs Merkel, Juncker will be kept out of it.

[/quote]

Not as far fetched as it seems. TM has not even got the bed warm yet and Merkel, Hollande etc are all joining the queue for talks. Merkel certainly understands you won’t hammer out all the details of a Brexit in just 2 years and informal talks have to take place first to get a broad agreement before Art. 50 is served, and then it’s just a matter of putting the finishing touches to the whole thing.

At the moment Juncker does Merkel’s bidding so he’s not even relevant just now, but the fly in the ointment will be the German elections next year, and it’s by no means sure Merkel will be re-elected.

[MartynSinclair]

As DC said in his leaving speech “the English channel is not getting any wider”… I think Merkel knows UK Plc will survive and she also realises the benefits of being proactive in the pre article 50 discussions.

On the other hand, I do not believe Juncker has a post exit plan for the EU and the UK pressing article 50 now, will be as confusing and difficult for the EU as well as UK… I wonder whether May will call Juncker’s bluff…

[WillieWelsh]

I read a prediction a few days back that May & Merkel will lead on this – apparently May’s second phone call was to Merkel – the first is traditionally to the US President and that says something. The estimated time scale is more like five years by which time a lot of things will change politically – four weeks ago would you have believed that Teflon May would be the PM? Brexit may never happen and if it doesn’t it will be because Britain and Germany jointly have forced a reshaping of the EU which both want and is long overdue.

[MrMichael]

I wish you were right WillieWelsh, but I fear you are not. May will have to deliver on immigration, that seems to be why most people voted out. Merkel grew up in the oldEast Germany and for her immigration is also a key issue, as in unlimited. I think on many things Merkel&May will get on like a house on fire, but on immigration they are going to be poles apart requiring one of them to do an about turn, and it would be an about turn out the door.

[cwoodward]

How things have changed in 6 years but not BAs woes
What a hopeless failure May and the other Tory’wets’ were
Not again I hope

[FormerBA]

Reading some of the earliest posts on this thread and the main take out is that few have aged well.

Its been the disaster that those who voted remain warned of. The EU by comparison is united (or certainly was in terms of its approach to Brexit). No one will be that stupid again though there is a case for throwing Hungary out!

There is an article from the Guardian doing the rounds on social media which highlighted that only when brexiteers have to queue for 3 hours, while EU citizens breeze through airport formalities, does the stupidity of the decision strike home.

I am a remainer and I think the decision was catastrophic for us as a country. I am in no doubt however that we will not be allowed back. Perfidious Albion has burnt its bridges. But I will never stop calling it for the stupidity it was.

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[MartynSinclair]

[quote quote=1216840]There is an article from the Guardian doing the rounds on social media which highlighted that only when brexiteers have to queue for 3 hours, while EU citizens breeze through airport formalities[/quote]

Nothing more stupid than Europeans still able to use UK border control, fast track and EGates – with no reciprocal arrangements for UK passport holders within mainland Europe. Just bonkers and so typical of the EU mentality. If we each were able to make it difficult for each other, perhaps a more agreeable and effective cross border solution could still be agreed.

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[FormerBA]

I agree with you but it was not the EU that allowed them to use E Gates here in the UK . It was Priti Patel’s Home office who where the blame for not negotiating a reciprocal deal. The EU are not singling out UK nationals, they are simply implementing their border controls, the same border controls we were told could not be implemented!!

The fact is if UK hadn’t done what they have done then the chaos at the UK border would be worse than it is.

For me, the stamps in the passport, the interrogation at the EU border on the reason for my journey and how long I will be there for, is hard to take, as dor 30 years I traveled with no impediment

[DannyBoy]

I agree with Nigel Farage it was not a perfect deal but we are in a better position. Also Tom Tugendhat MP said it best the other day when he criticised Tobias Ellwood on Twitter.

“Tobias is wrong. The Single Market puts the EU in charge:
– EU rules
– open borders
– no new trade deals

We need a deal British people control not foreign laws with no say.

Let’s plan for the future and stop looking back. This decision is made.”

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