[Tom Otley]

The initial report has been published

https://www.gcaa.gov.ae/en/ePublication/admin/iradmin/Lists/Incidents%20Investigation%20Reports/Attachments/90/2016-2016%20-%20Preliminary%20Report,%20AAIS%20Case%20AIFN-0008-2016%20-%20A6-EMW.pdf

[mkcol74]

@TomOtley – Fascinating reading, even just skimming through some of it. Thanks for sharing.

[FDOS_UK]

Mmmmmm…..

I’m not a professional pilot, but I interpret this in this way

– a/c had a windshear encounter and touched down outside the touchdown zone, so landing performance not guaranteed and a go around was necessary

– because the wheels had touched (WOW sensor activated), the autothrust logic had switchedfrom flight to land mode

– the pilot probably hit the TOGA (take off go around) switch and followed the flight director to pitch the nose up, expecting the autothrust to power up the engines – the pilots set go around flap and selected ‘gear up’, causing the wheels tostart traveling

– The momentum of the jet carried it back into the air, but the autothrust was in ground mode and didn’t command power

– the airspeed decayed rapidly and by the time the pilots recognised the problem and physically pushed the thrust levers forward, the aircraft was sinking too quickly for the engines to spool up quickly enough to provide sufficient thrust to climb away

– the aircraft struck the runway with the gear in transit

[canucklad]

My mate, pretty much predicted what the report suggests.
Another scenario where automation and instinctive piloting skills are at odds

Still, really impressed with the actions of all the crew immediately following the crash.

[MartynSinclair]

Something that stood out in the report for me was the age of the Captain, 34….(for a long haul aircraft)….

I know Virgin once had a 747 Captain in his early 20’s, my own flying instructor was the youngest 757 Captain in the UK at the time (early 80’s)… but is the age of Captain’s reducing somewhat. I would be interested to see if there are any stats about the average age of a Captain and also where they received their initial flight training.

The report was interesting, but I think the report heading “Runway Impact During Attempted Go-Around” really sums the situation up…

The report read like the BMA, M1 accident, pilots not interpreting the information they needed to interpret, correctly.

[Cashsuds]

The case for restricted carry on becomes stronger than ever. I cannot see why people have to lug their luggage into the cabin!!! The temptation is too great for anyone to think logically under these circumstances. Ban all carry ons larger than a satchel!!!

[Poshgirl58]

[quote quote=757416]The case for restricted carry on becomes stronger than ever. I cannot see why people have to lug their luggage into the cabin!!! The temptation is too great for anyone to think logically under these circumstances. Ban all carry ons larger than a satchel!!!
[/quote]

Totally agree. The emergency cards should also be amended to show a suitable graphic for leaving bags behind.

[travelworld]

I don’t often share the same views as FDOS on BA but his insight into the report is fascinating- thank you for that.

[PegasusAir]

From a quick read I was interested and maybe a bit surprised that non of the exits worked quite as they should although some obviously were due to smoke/potential fire and wind so not a fault of the equipment. However of the 10 doors five were blocked (L1 slide detached, R1 blown by wind, L3 and R3 due smoke and L4 deployed but blown against aircraft). L2 deployed but not to the ground, R2 temp redirected passengers to other exit due smoke but eventually used, R4 used but passengers got stuck on the slide due water, L5 used but eventually blown against aircraft and discontinued and R5 lifted by wind but later used. I think I have these right but it will be interesting to read eventually how long the evacuation took with all these problems. I think the test exercise is a full evacuation in 90 (180?)secs with two doors blocked. Full marks to the Cabin Crew who despite these challenges got everyone off safely. Thanks for putting this initial factual report on here and to the UAE for issuing such relatively quickly.

[canucklad]

I might of mentioned my idea on here before.I did suggest it to my CX mate when chatting about this incident and he thought my idea was tremoundous.

Once the cabin is secure for take-off and landing (I suggested the doors to manual/automatic stage) the overhead lockers are centrally locked.

Opened up, only after the seatbelt sign is switched off after TO and Landing

This would also stop people getting up immiedately after landing !

[MrMichael]

@MartynSinclair, are you sure your flying instructor was the youngest 757 captain, if he was in his early 80’s surely he would be one of the oldest 🙂

I just read some of the report in to the accident, I am no Pilot, but it seems to me they simply retracted the undercarriage far too early. On another forum a poster who is a pilot states the mantra on a go around should be :-

Power Up, Pitch Up, Flaps Up, Gear Up, in that order.

In this instance it would seem gear up was first, power up last!

[FDOS_UK]

[quote quote=757449] @MartynSinclair, are you sure your flying instructor was the youngest 757 captain, if he was in his early 80’s surely he would be one of the oldest

I just read some of the report in to the accident, I am no Pilot, but it seems to me they simply retracted the undercarriage far too early. On another forum a poster who is a pilot states the mantra on a go around should be :-

Power Up, Pitch Up, Flaps Up, Gear Up, in that order.

In this instance it would seem gear up was first, power up last!

[/quote]

Mr Michael

Caveat – from a PPL, not ATPL or CPL.

I havn’t seen the 777 go around checklist, but I’d anticipate something like

– TOGA
– set flaps
– When positive rate of climb observed, select gear up

I expect that the PF (pilot flying) hit the TOGA button (on the thrust levers), followed the pitch onthe flight director and called for go around flaps.

The PNF (pilot not flying) would call ‘positive rate of climb’ as the ship left the ground, so the PF would then call for gear up.

As a former pilot with time on multi engined retractable aircraft (on a much more modest scale) there is little purpose to leaving the gear down, once you have a positive rate of climb – yes, drag will increase somewhat as the gear doors open and the wheels retract, but that is eliminated as soon as the doors close again.

The gotcha here is autothrust not commanding power – I’d be interested if any airline piots are reading, if their checklists include a ‘verify thrust’ step after positive climb?

Funnily enough, on a light single engined retract, I’d leave the gear down until at a safe altitude, just in case of engine failure and a forced landing ahead, but not on amulti engine.

[MartynSinclair]

@Mr Michael, due to the new forum format, I couldn’t edit when I realised I was turning the youngest 757 Captain to the oldest.

Couldn’t find how the flaps were set for on the accident aircraft, but if the flaps were in landing position (highly likely) they would need to be raised before the aircraft could become airborne.

There is a wonderful training video of pilots exercising touch and go’s in a 747. Watch how the third pilot raises the flaps from landing to take off. In the stresses environment of a long landing… may be there were errors.

[PeterCoultas]

MartynS: Very interesting video and also,in view of comments made during the video re the usefulness of Manston, shows how idiotic the current plans to turn this airport into a housing estate really are. Central government really needs to gat a grip on a joined up strategy for UK airports with local authorities (e.g Thanet) not being able to swan off with their own daft plans.

[mkcol74]

[quote quote=757434]From a quick read I was interested and maybe a bit surprised that non of the exits worked quite as they should although some obviously were due to smoke/potential fire and wind so not a fault of the equipment. However of the 10 doors five were blocked (L1 slide detached, R1 blown by wind, L3 and R3 due smoke and L4 deployed but blown against aircraft). L2 deployed but not to the ground, R2 temp redirected passengers to other exit due smoke but eventually used, R4 used but passengers got stuck on the slide due water, L5 used but eventually blown against aircraft and discontinued and R5 lifted by wind but later used. I think I have these right but it will be interesting to read eventually how long the evacuation took with all these problems. I think the test exercise is a full evacuation in 90 (180?)secs with two doors blocked. Full marks to the Cabin Crew who despite these challenges got everyone off safely. Thanks for putting this initial factual report on here and to the UAE for issuing such relatively quickly.

[/quote]

All of the exits worked as they should when opened (once opened, sometimes with assistance), however it was once opened that issues came into play, mostly due to the external environment.

Crew have 90 seconds to evacuate using 50% of available exits, in the test environment.

[Author]

Posts