[Bath_VIP]

It is interesting to review the smaller airports in the UK to see how viable they are. I think you can group them into 3 types.

1. Occasional schedule services.
I would include Oxford, Cambridge, Dundee, Lydd, Shoreham, Coventry, Gloucester, Chester, Valley & Carlisle in this. These sometimes have services, sometimes not. Often what keeps them going is another aviation line such as pilot training at Oxford and scheduled services are merely a bonus.

2. A few regular business schedules
Teeside, Humberside & Highlands & islands airports probably fall into this group where they only have a handful of scheduled services but they tend to be self sustaining either due to local business needs or serving remote populations.

3. Mostly leisure services
Blackpool, Bournemouth & Doncaster all fall into this group. The lack of business routes is almost certainly due to a larger neighbouring airport which means they have to scrabble for the leisure passengers.

Maybe the demise of Blackpool suggests that these types of airports are most at risk. Then again Manston clearly fell in the 1st group but still went under despite its cargo operations.

[MrMichael]

You could be right Bath_VIP, however I do have concerns over Southampton. It seems 90% of its passengers are flying Flybe metal, and putting all ones eggs in the same basket can lead to disaster. If something happened to Flybe, what would happen to SOU. Bournmouth, Blackpool, Leeds/Bradford, Bristol are reliant almost exclusively on one or two carriers for their business. Even Stansted seems to be.

[SimonS1]

Transtaxman – I don’t get the bit about being entitled to services to Heathrow. I believe Blackpool is the 135th biggest population in the UK so even if 10% of those feel they have a right then LHR will need a lot of extra runways to accommodate them. Not to mention other smaller places with good arguments like IoM, Guernsey etc.

The people of Blackpool didn’t support the services to Stansted and I doubt there is that much connecting traffic.

I saw online that the airport ran out of fuel this week forcing flights to stop at East Midlands to take on fuel. Sounds like comedy hour really.

http://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/news/community/community-news/appalling-situation-as-airport-runs-out-of-fuel-1-6881868

[transtraxman]

please AMcWhirter and Simon1 the name is TransTRaxman not Transtaxman.
Trax as is tracks certainly not tax.

I seem to remember that Blackpool had a connection to Heathrow in the days of Starways before it became British Eagle, which is going back somewhat, but maybe I am wrong. You have the information more readily available than I.

If my memory is correct there have been flights from Carlisle, Humberside and Norwich but into Heathrow or Gatwick I cannot remember.

@Simon1
I would like to point out that in both Italy(Sardinia and Sicily) and Spain(the Balearics and the Canaries) there exist subsidies to help promote flights to/from those places. It would not surprise me if the same happened in France or Greece, but I know not.

The process is called nation building. In the UK, however, most if not all is profit motivated so said subsidies do not exist.

The Isle of Man,the Channel Islands as well as the outer reaches of Great Britain (not counting Ireland) will never have competitive road or rail transport to the capital´s hub airport. Is it not logical and fair that they have a chance to develop with air connections which are not solely dictated by economics?

For me that is one of the principal reasons why there should be a third runway at LHR.
I have more thoughts here if you care to read them…

http://trans-trax.blogspot.com.es/2012/02/heathrows-3rd-runway-how-to-focus.html

[Bath_VIP]

The lack of Heathrow access for the smaller airports is not the result of economics but politics, transtraxman. If Heathrow (or somewhere else) had the capacity, there would be flights as airlines have demonstrated this in the past. Indeed BMI used to do flights from Birmingham to heathrow which seems crackers given the distance but they ran for many years.

[andystock]

BBC video report: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-29540514

[SimonS1]

@transtraxman – a bit of a rag bag of issues there.

The UK is no different to Italy and Spain. Flights to places like the Highlands and Islands and Newquay are operated under a PSO and subsidised. However typically these exist where it would otherwise be unlikely that an operator would fly on the route. The purpose is to provide a link to the capital which is why PSO flights use airports like LCY and LGW (or in the case of Scotland to connect people through Glasgow). The purpose isn’t to create connecting traffic at Heathrow – that is a commercial issue and if BA think there is enough demand they could for example use a Leeds slot to go to Blackpool instead.

Of course we would all like flights to Heathrow. It would be handy for me if there was a flight from Brighton/Shoreham to connect there. However even with an extra 3 runways the days of flights to Blackpool, Norwich etc are gone and it will not happen.

However it isn’t possibly to do this on all routes as it has to be paid by the taxpayer and there are plenty of people (like me) who don’t see why taxes should be used to subsidise flights to say Blackpool. Firstly because there are other airports reasonably close by and secondly because airlines like Ryanair are/were willing to operate flights but pulled the route because there was no demand.

The IoM and Channel Islands don’t need PSO flights as there are commercial operators operating. I went to IoM 2 days ago from LCY and it cost about £150 return.

If Spain and Italy are using this very liberally (and I don’t believe they are) then it would help explain why their economies are such basket cases and their attempts at nation building as you put it have ended up with vast numbers of people unemployed.

If nation building is a priority then there are other areas that need tackling. You can’t mention the I word on here without the mods getting uptight but see last night’s by election results for further info…..

[solartravels]

Whilst I am not a user of Blackpool airport (I only knew it existed because Jet2 operated a route from there), I do have Durham Tees Valley (formerly Teesside) literally on my doorstep (within 5 miles) and I live on the flight path.

DTV serves only Amsterdam (KLM) and Aberdeen (Eastern) and is used predominantly by Oil/Gas/Energy sectors as Teesside is a base for such too.

As an airport, it’s incredibly handy for me. Parking is metres from the terminal and security is quick (as only a few flights a day pass through). There is a GBP 6 fee for passing through security. I am happy to pay this as it much outweighs the extra travel time (an hour) to get to Newcastle or Leeds for an LHR or AMS connection, not to mention fuel and extra parking. However I can’t see why anyone from outside of the Teesside area would use this airport. As sad as that is.

BMI used to operate flights to LHR that stopped even before BA/IAG took over. Now LBA and NCL both have BA feeders.

Interestingly, Peel Airports owns Durham Tees Valley along with a collection of local authorities, and is making lots of noise about redeveloping areas of the airport into freight/commercial zones, hotels and housing. I am a supporter of this for two reasons: firstly there is sufficient land around the airport that can be utilised. It is needed from an economic point of view (job creation etc). Secondly if they aren’t able to redevelop, then there is no business to keep open and this is a bigger problem for the local authorities who own a stake in the airport.

I will continue to support my local airport as much as I can. Sometimes the flight prices to AMS are silly, down to corporate traffic I presume.

[SimonS1]

Interesting comments there solartravels.

KLM have been pretty good at mining the UK regional airports for traffic to put through Amsterdam. If they can’t make a case for flights from Blackpool then it’s a pretty good indicator that LHR wouldn’t work either.

Are the LBA flights still half full these days?

[PegasusAir]

The problem with all coastal airports is that part of their catchment area is water not population. This is partly overcome if the principle direction of onward travel is over the water so the population feeds in from behind eg Southampton and even Southend. The main population for BLK is east and then very quickly the nearest Airport becomes MAN.
Blackpool never had a route to LHR but it did to LGW for a few years in the 60’s. At that time BLK was one one the busiest airports in the UK with over 40 flights a day to the IOM in the peak plus many daily flights to BFS and DUB with 36 & 50 seater aircraft. Note the direction of travel. These airports have not been viable for years – holiday patterns change, but in the case of BLK it’s decline was partly offset by quite a large general aviation activity, helicopters for the gas fields and a few charter/LCC’s. Of course the land which is almost on the coast between two towns may have a significant value?

[canucklad]

Ref: Blackpool
I don’t know that much about it, and frankly don’t really care. But it does seem to me that there are a few business dynamics here that haven’t synchronized together. Or to business jibberish, the opportunity to synergise profitable opportunities has been lost.
Blackpool as a resort has been struggling to maintain visitor numbers. Last time I was there, I noticed work being done on the beachfront. So the council is/was spending money on the infrastructure. Turn around and look at the shops and the retail offering and your back to tat. Basil’s Torquay offering was palatial compared to where me and my ex stayed!! A destination of choice it is not.
Now combine the demographic target audience of FRlightmare and the appeal of Blackpool , and the amount of people in their target audience that either don’t have or wont pay for a passport, and then factor in how difficult or expensive it is to get to, and I’d suggest a match made in marketing heaven.
So I suggest that Blackpool Airport and their £10 levy , haven’t only hurt themselves but the community their supposed to serve.
FR probably could of made EDI, DUB, CDF and possibly a few other routes work.

+ my ex’s dad used to use BLK to transit to the gas fields as said by PegasusAir

[SimonS1]

I suppose in the 1960s the 40 or so flights a day were full of pleasure seekers who were enjoying the thrill of flying for the first few times. A bit like the people who used to fly from Lydd to Le Touquet for the day. It was a real treat, genuine service with a smile. Roll up about 30 mins before the flight and things like ‘security’ and ‘conformance’ were alien concepts.

These days flying is easily available to the masses, and the pleasure has largely disappeared. More likely sour faces all round. When I went to the IOM the people in Ronaldsway security were a real bunch of jobsworths and the BA purser on the way out could have cracked concrete with the scowl on her face (although to be fair the three on EZY on the way back were fairly chipper). Just a means of getting from A to B really.

[transtraxman]

@canucklad
“….haven’t only hurt themselves but the community their supposed to serve.
FR probably could of made EDI, ………..”

should read

“…haven´t only hurt themselves but the community they´ re supposed to serve.
FR probably could have made EDI ….”.

At least let us get the English right.

[openfly]

There were a few months in the mid eighties when Blackpool had a route to LGW and LHR. This was when MAN was closed due to massive expansion work, and Blackpool was used instead. The ticketing was ex-MAN. BA did the LHR and BCal the LGW, both with 1-11s with restricted loads due to the short runway.

[slotski]

SimonS1 I recently flew LHR-LBA twice. Both on a Sunday evenings. The flights were busy. The last one was almost full.

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