BA/Iberia…Time to split?

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  • Henkel.Trocken

    Since when was Wikipedia a credible source?

    It probably suits the person who quotes it but please, for those with a drain of intelligence, please don’t reference your claims with it.

    Well done BigDog @ 16.15. I predict that Krug will now go quiet and if we are lucky, he may even disappear for a few days. It’s usually what happens when he’s challenged or facts are put to him contradicting his agenda.

    I’m disappointed I’m not named with Tete et al! Then never having been a member of a trade union in my life….


    Alex, IMO TAP was the far better deal or better still build-your-own.

    – far cheaper,
    – a buyout as opposed to merger
    – control retained in UK
    – far better routes into Brazil, an economy which is bigger than the next 5 latin american economies combined.
    – other Latin American connections….

    @Henkel 17:02
    Thanks, I hope he takes me up as I have been very sceptical of his various claims and it will at least put an end to his fallacious aspersions.


    Hi BigDog

    Thanks for the link. Interesting to hear about structural change, synergies, efficiencies, making tough decisions etc., but the bit that was missing, and which is pretty fundamental, is ” what are you doing it for ?”, and the lack of mention of any ultimate objective.

    Had he said words to the effect ” to create the recognised leader in product innovation and customer service, leading to ever growing market share, long term customer loyalty, bla bla bla with a sustainable business model ” then I may have been convinced.

    All I got from him was restructure and take out cost. Sadly, to borrow from another thread, that translates to customers having grotty little hot towels.


    The problem with TAP is that the group is heavily indebted and TAP is loss making. It would require the same tough restructuring as Iberia and not only that there is no scope for growth at Lisbon, unlike Madrid which has huge potential.

    eselle You need only look at all the investment now going on at BA (which the anti BA agenda fails to recognise) to see how airlines can flourish once the necessary hard work has been done.


    Hippo, for future reference I am pro BA and believe it has great potential. I am anti-Walsh as the guy does not demonstrate the attributes needed to realise the potential within BA. Infact he could damage it, fatally.


    I’ve long said that TAP is the better partner.

    TAP is still owned by the Portuguese state and it could sell it off debt free.

    A new airport is needed for Lisbon, and there are plans already for this.


    Valid point BigDog re: anti Walsh and not anti BA. The product has deteriorated on Walsh’s watch without cause or reason.

    I think I’ve been clear time and again that I don’t view him as suitable for the job. In the minds of the blinkered few, that makes me anti BA.

    I long for the day when again BA is industry leading not trailing behind. There is so much more to running an airline well than reducing costs ruthlessly.

    In any industry you balance cost and quality. Your biggest cost is your staff so you take them with you and keep them motivated. This is probably his biggest failure though I know others will disagree but I say it as an industry insider.

    Second, the passenger product has deteriorated on his watch. Business class needs a total revamp and first has had nothing better than cosmetic changes. In spite of the ‘height cuisine’ programme we heard so much about including on this board the food reall remains pretty dreadful and crew quite often serve it with an apology.

    So, I’ll keep flying with others until BA have new management and they catch up. I’d be delighted to spend my money with them again but not for the current offerings. It’s simply not worth the money and there is far better out there.

    As for Iberia, it was a sad mistake and one that would be best rectified quickly. In doing that the CEO of IAG should go, he’s not fit for purpose and I have a feeling he may have met his match with the Spanish unions who have plenty of learning from his mismanagement at BA to learn from.


    @ Henkel.Trocken – 06/03/2013 17:02 GMT

    You very clearly have not read the source. Wikipedia is referenced throughout and its analysis of the 2007-08 financial crash is both well researched, well-written and rounded in its portrayal of what happened and the consequences.

    Should you wish to look down your nose at Wikipedia, it’s your choice. However please stop disparaging a considerably more balanced, nuanced and intelligent source than is frequently found in much of the UK print media – unless you can point to a more reliable and informed source.


    Oh dear, I can’t believe anyone takes their references from Wikipedia.


    @ CXDiamond – 06/03/2013 19:01 GMT

    As opposed to what? There really are some pompous asses on this site.


    Mr Dunn, please feel free to take off your pompous ass hat, your posts may be more interesting if you do. Generally I skip them as they are so boring.

    On on line blog that can be altered by anyone who chooses to is hardly a reliable source and the integrity of the information is far from sure.

    As for ‘what’, well it depends on what you are looking for but I certainly wouldn’t trust information found in Wikipedia or quote it.

    I despair.

    CXDiamond, try returning to the topic or I will be skipping your posts in future.

    What a letdown you are after your very eloquent post @ 18:55.



    Please do feel free to skip my posts. I’m certainly not posting to seek your or for that matter anyone else’s approval.

    So sorry to disappoint you.


    Good point. How many of us post just to be heard without listening?

    I get over my little tantrums very quickly!


    Edited: please don’t apologise to me. I think Anthony is due an apology.


    @ Hippocampus – 06/03/2013 15:15 GMT
    Thank you so much for your nice comment re the “so many nonsense from the anti BA agenda”.
    I’m sure it’s difficult for you to imagine but yes, some people have a different opinion from yours re BA and surprisingly not all of them are “anti BA” !
    I’m sure that no one consider IB as a leisure airline and fly IB for business not only for holidays. As far as I’m concerned, I never used IB. Did you ?
    I’m sure that the IB/BA merger is the best merger ever in the airline industry but everybody agree that LX or KLM would have be much better. Better than what ?
    Northern Europe and Southern Europe are very different. The BA/IB merger was risky. I hope it won’t fail but I’m afraid the culture gap + the economic crisis in Spain won’t make it possible to make it a success before IAG’s share goes down. And when the shares go down …

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