BA squeezing two more rows into short-haul aircraft.

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  • AMcWhirter

    It appears that Club Europe will retain 30 ins of pitch.

    But, as I noted above, Lufthansa has taken the decision (when its A320 neos arrived over one year ago) to increase business class pitch from 30 ins to 31.8 ins.


    BA cannot retain the 30″ seat pitch in Club Europe as they operate a movable divider. If they decide to keep the paltry 30″ in CE for a fixed number of rows, then the rows behind will be even more cramped, possibly reduced as low as 26″ seat pitch.
    This is another plan in BA that hasn’t been thought out.
    If this is the case the crew will not be able to manoeuvre the BoB trolley through the cabin due to all the legs overflowing into the aisle.


    FDOS: the equipment harmonisation/standardisation across the IB/BA/VY/EI was flagged up in the most recent IAG Capital Markets Day presentation. The objective is to be able to switch any aircraft between the various short/medium-haul fleets within five working days which, presumably, includes an external paint job. As VY doesn’t (correct me if I am wrong) have a J cabin, I assume that it is this tail that is wagging the dog over seat pitches – albeit that you would think that they could shift seating around within a five day timeframe.


    Just received an email from Alex Cruz office confirming that Club Europe seat pitch will be reduced to 28″ seat pitch in line with the economy seats when the aircraft go through their squeeze programme.
    And they expect us to pay £500 for this… legs will definitely be in the aisle!


    We’ll soon have wifi on BA shorthaul to take your mind off the cramp and discomfort and possible DVT, especially in window seats. Just get an aisle seat and take regular exercise to the galley for extra wine,etc. and then to the toilet!


    openfly, you wrote “Just received an email from Alex Cruz office confirming that Club Europe seat pitch will be reduced to 28″…”.

    Thanks a lot for the information, that’s helpful. But the news is too much for me – despite my name on this forum, I still fly BA regularly, often in Club Europe. That will change if it’s 28″, I’m tall and could barely squeeze into that.


    Once wifi is available and laptop use increases, I wonder how passengers will react when the seat in front reclines into a passengers lap top screen?…


    So what’s the point of flying in Club Europe if the seat pitch is 28″?


    This is a very interesting thread and although we have discussed it in other threads that were slightly different I think this is an important topic.

    I have often asked the question, what would it take for loyal BA passengers to say enough is enough and vote with their feet because until enough of them do then BA will continue to do exactly what it wants without the fear of a backlash from it’s passengers.

    There are I agree, a number of passengers who benefit sufficiently from the Avios that they earn from long haul flights and then use for domestic or European flights. this makes sense to me but what about all the others? why do they continue to fly on BA when there are many alternatives that offer better value for money particularly on shorter routes.

    People who know me on this forum are aware that I am no great fan of BA but I am not a BA basher either but I voted with my feet a long time ago as it reached the point where the Gold Card benefits and avios just did not make up for the cost differential that BA expected me to pay.

    For example I travel to Tel Aviv at least once a month sometimes more and I always flew BA. Easyjet is now my carrier of choice on this route as they fly have daily flights and double daily on 4 days of the week. I just returned yesterday from a 4 day trip and my ticket including seats with legroom both ways cost me £160, for the same itinerary the best BA could offer me was £450. a very easy choice as far as I am concerned, particularly given that it is a non stop flight. I know you can get cheaper flights if you fly via somewhere else and I know there are many out there who would not want to do that which I fully understand.

    Why do more people not do the same thing, there are many people on this forum who complain of high fares and a decrease in the service offered and yet still stay loyal to BA. I am not criticising their choice, I would simply like to understand it?

    Interested to hear the thoughts of others on this, particularly those who continue to fly with BA despite the savings that could be made if they flew with other carriers.


    Hi Jonathan – to try and answer your question:

    I fly BA short haul rarely and then only if they are similar in cost to EZY, Ryanair and Norwegian, who fly the same route. They tend to be the best priced option around 30-35% of the time.

    I stick with BAEC, not necessarily BA, as they offer, IMHO, the best overall package for my business travel needs.

    For example, I fly to MIA, FLL, TPA, ORD & NYC. BA are the only airline that fly these routes non-stop. There is the added benefit of additional non stop flights with AA on the majority of these, so convenience wise they cannot be beaten. More often than not they are competitive on price when (which I now do rarely) checked against DL / UA / VS.

    When I travel to Asia I have not flown on BA metal in 5 years. I fly mainly with CX, then QR. The reason being they are better priced (and arguably better quality) than BA. To the extent where I don’t mind an indirect routing. I rate CX higher than QR as at least one of my legs is a non-stop, as opposed to changing in both directions.

    I find the BAEC gold benefits better than Star Alliance at a similar level. (F lounges for example). Amex 2-4-1 is an added bonus.

    I try not to complain (too much) about an airline as frankly I don’t see the point, as I can expend my energy far more productively elsewhere.
    Could I fly at a lower cost by mixing and matching long haul carriers more – Yes.
    Am I prepared to pay a little more and stick with one airline alliance (in general) for what I perceive to be added convenience – Yes.
    I value convenience and minimising the time I’m away from my family highly.

    Hope this helps a little!


    Having just flown 2 hour Cathay BKK to Hong Kong Business class, BA needs to review longer short haul seating, service. Maybe old fashioned first class seating, proper service? Bring back European First class? Or get rid?



    I think we have to realise that whilst Snr Cruz and Willie Walsh are at BAs helm, then the Vueling business model is their ideal world. When the BA standards hit rock bottom in the near future the flying world will tell them to leave.
    Only then will things start to improve again and the UK can, again, be proud of its national carrier.
    It happened with Swiss and it will happen here when BA realises that it must start a new “Customer First” programme.


    Walsh is driven purely by TSR.

    Whilst he is at the helm, those running the individual brands will be following that objective. Crap service and product are good short term drivers of TSR because they save money.

    Somewhere there is an algorithm that tells him how much further her can go before the damage done starts to mitigate against TSR.


    I am sure BA will be creating a spin about the new F class check in area in T5 when it opens. “We have listened to our customers” and all that.

    Whilst I am sure it will be a wonderful experience for those eligible, I am sure if BA were really listening to the customers, they would be investing more in the on board travel experience rather than ‘adjusting’ how Gold card holders enter the lounge.

    Oh and watch out for the tantrums when Golds travelling with their families are turned away from the new F check in area.. same rules apply to the F area that apply to the lounges… one guest per eligible card holder. So Golds travelling with more than one guest… sorry, its the normal check in area for you!


    I think the new F check in area leads to F security and into the F lounge.
    I suspect if a Gold travelling with more than one guest checks-in in this area, they might then get directed to proceed through regular fast track security once checked in?
    Don’t necessarily see them not getting checked in, but per lounge policy, might not then be able to traverse through F security due to ending up directly in F lounge.
    It could be as most frequent fliers know their respective airline’s lounge policy, the tantrums are likely to be from the DYKWIA brigade.

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