[Hippocampus]

“Isn’t it interesting that BA refuses to go to independent binding arbitration with respect to suspensions and firings?”

No. I don’t see why established disciplinary procedures should be outsourced to a third party. BA management run BA. I don’t think any other company would agree to this.

“Isn’t it interesting BA insisted on all legal cases against them being dropped in their recent offer?”

No it isn’t. This is standard in any settlement. If court cases continue, then it is axiomatic there is no settlement. Conducting litigation (even when against a hopelessly disorganised opponent) is time consuming and expensive.

“Interestingly although BA has won a couple more cases against Unite than it has lost BA has not been awarded costs. “

In the case of the crewing levels case, I understand Unite has sought leave to appeal to The Supreme Court. It is common for the issue of costs to be dealt with once litigation in a case has been ultimately concluded. Once this is done, I would expect BA to apply for costs. All three Court of Appeal judges were in agreement (very often you can have judges disagreeing or finding in favour of the same party, but for different reasons) so it was hardly finely balanced.

“The strike is about bullying, victimisation and intimidation”

No it wasn’t. It was about the “imposition” of changes to crewing levels at LHR, which the High Court and Court of Appeal found to be reasonable.

A cynic might suggest that having lost in the courts (where the evidence showed that the disputes between BASSA and CC89 made it impossible for there to be any sensible negotiation – which all other departments achieved) on the issue of imposition, BASSA is doing anything to drag this issue out further with a shopping list of grievances.

[JudgedRed]

Interestingly enough strikers in the 70’s were responsible for bringing down a Socialist government following the notorious “winter of discontent”. Prolonged strike action killed the British car industry and accelerated the demise of the coal industry. Trust me, BA will go the same way. If the autocratic management style mentioned by a previous poster is to blame for the unrest then why doesn’t BA suffer from crippling levels of staff turnover ?

This dispute is about power not principle

[CallMeIshmael]

Personally I do think it interesting that BA finds it acceptable to have a third party overturn established operating procedures and broke long standing agreements – yet does not want to use ACAS to help resolve the suspension and firing impasse. It is usual when industrial relations are so fractured to use arbitration. However BA leadership appear so devoid of emotional intellegence being hell bent on asserting their power over resolving the dispute fairly.

I can also understand that BA doesn’t want to have the stick of removing staff travel adjudicated in court so it can continue to threaten it again. It is also interesting that BA doesn’t want to see the cases where it has made potentially illegal deductions from pay packets adjudicated upon as it would mean compensating 7,000 strikers.

Walsh must be a candidate for hypocrite of the year when asserting Unite was dysfunctional due to its affiliates BASSA and CC89 being at odds. Back in 1989 BA bankrolled a new union with the agenda of usurping BASSA with a more compliant alternative. BA gave this union advance access to new cabin crew recruits, prestigious offices and facilities and special treatment. This union was CC89.

Although BA failed in its objective it did succeed in creating disharmony. Interestingly though CC89 has recently been so disenchanted with the BA leadership it was the first to reject BA’s proposal which BASSA was considering.

BA leadership ??? has an industry leading litany of corrupt actions, fines and sharp practices proven in court and well documented. Is it any wonder that this talent has been brought to bear on its own staff?

Continue your cruise down the mighty Egyptian river.

[CallMeIshmael]

Judgedred you make a fair point.

The detritus resulting from bad leadership/management or failed M&A usually manifests itself half way through economic upturns as there are relatively few alternative opportunities available during downturns.

Having said, that I understand there are many managers and staff within waterside that have become so disenchanted have chosen to leave without being offered severance hence many temps and interims being used. These staff understand, regardless of outcome, the culture of fear and intimidation fostered by Walsh’s leadership team will have a long term toxic legacy.

The Kegworth crash highlighted the need for flight and cabin crew to work as one for safety reasons. BA had tried to imbue a flight team culture with the CRM initiative over several years. Relying on his emotional intelligence skills Walsh pitted flight crew against cabin crew to get a short term advantage. This action alone will adversely impact flight crew relations and potentially safety for years to come.

This may well be Walsh’s agenda – to create such a de-motivated, disharmonious team across BA as a whole, with staff who loathe their workplace and leave, thus reducing severance costs and long term pension obligations.

[FlyingChinaman]

I have read enough arguments from with this BA/CC thread for the last 12 months
!
As an outsider to your UK region but a frequent traveller on BA, I have the following YEAR-END comments to make.

BA: It is trying to stay in business and be healthy in this uncertain economic time. The CEO of IATA just stated last week that although there is an industrial wide profit of 2.7% this year, next year’s prediction is going to be1.5%! The aviation industry as a whole is trying to recover their capital investment so far only managed to achieved half of it. The oil price swing is a big big concern to the future profits of this very sick industry wilt very low returns!

So clearly BA management is trying very hard to stay afloat or “airborne” in the years to come. My understanding is they got co-operation from all others departments (including the cockpit crew) to help the company to maintain this target EXECPT the Cabin crew!
I also understand that some of the cabin crew feel caught in this endless battle.

CC: I know every employee (worldwide) would like to defend their existing working conditions/perks/previleges whether it is justifiable or not in this current economic climate. Unfortunately changes have to be made by the management to embrace the new world business model no matter what and it’s a hard fact. It is not bullying but a economc necessity. The sooner the CC understands the reality instead of all up in the “air”, there may be future for these in-flight professionals.

There is no such a thing as life-time employment any more in any society. All employees must support their companies to maintain that status quo.

The travelling public: May 2011 be a strike-free year for flying with BA!

[CharlesJones]

FlyingChinaman….you are wrong that cabin crew didn’t co-operate with BA. They even offered a pay cut and conditions just like the pilots. The media unfortunately don’t really report the facts. Unlike many of the posters on here,I am privy as to what is really going on and why. I wholeheartedly agree with you,let’s hope BA is free of any strikes in 2011.

[VintageKrug]

BASSA never offered a permanent, structural reduction in costs. Is is deceptive to suggest they did.

BA never asked the Union for a pay cut; it always (and still maintains) the position that current crew pay and T&Cs would remain as they do today, and it is now offering a pay RISE as part of the most recent offer which was never put to a vote of BASSA members, denying their democratic right to determine their Union’s position on this matter.

BASSA expected any savings made in the short term to be fully repaid – in effect it was a “loan” which did nothing to address the structural problem.

BASSA suggested it could generate £170m of savings; this figure was independently audited by PwC, and found to total less than £52m, THREE TIMES less than was claimed.

[Hippocampus]

CharlesJones – You do not need to rely on the media – it has been established (twice) before a court of law that BASSA and CC89 did not co-operate with the company and their savings were not what they claimed and they were only temporary savings that had to be paid back. If BA wants a loan, it can just go to a bank.

The constant rehashing of outright lies and half-truths to justify BASSA’s actions and ignorance of any arguments against BASSA has been a constant leitmotif of this dispute.

As for the ludicrous claim that this whole dispute is an orchested war by “Walsh” against the workforce and an attempt to pit pilots against cabin crew, this is sheer fantasy. The near pathological obsession some in BASSA have about “Walsh” and the pilots (why single out one workgroup?) is remarkable, as are the attempts at post-event rationalisation.

NB. CallMeIshmael – I think you mean Kegworth, not Knebworth.

[CallMeIshmael]

You make a fair point FlyingChinaman. The UK government is trying to make billions in savings mainly due to a tad profligate attitude of the prior government. In the NHS they are making cuts to the back office whilst committing to maintain front line service.
Currently out of 10 BA employees less than 3 are engaged in actual flying. Compare that with easyjet where 9 out of 10 employees are flying. BA has gone some way to reduce to huge non front line overhead and they have still a significant way to go. Over many years BA has built a huge bureaucratic behemoth with expensive tastes – visit waterside HQ and you will understand.

Flight crew gave up a spare member of the flight deck on certain routes as they were mainly redundant due to increased sophistication, safety and control in jet airliners. Am sure if the BA leadership could come up with robots or maybe a self service vending alternative to serving passengers then savings could be made in the cabin crew until that happens the high correlation between passenger numbers and crewing numbers will remain.
I see validity in Judgedred point – this is about BA leadership wishing to assert their power. It is so autocratic 1960’s and shown to be the worst of leadership style then and it will be again. The NEDs should give Broughton, Walsh and the leadership team a copy of Good to Great (Collins) and find the chapter on the virtues of bullying, intimidation and victimising as a successful leadership style …. There isn’t one… Alternatively get them on an Emotional Intelligence course – I would recommend Dr. Martin Newman. True leaders have willing followers. Walsh and his team are a group of guys going for a walk.

BA and passenger airlines generally are people businesses. To be successful they need a highly motivated, dedicated group of front line people. BA’s leadership has resulted in the opposite. In tough times, volcanoes, bad weather, major issues etc BA will need to call on the good will of their front line staff to keep the business running. The good will account will be empty for years.

Krug continue down the river, the facts on the ground tell a very different story to the manipulated figures BA publish and the morale within Waterside, but hey we wouldn’t expect anything less from a proven, in court, corrupt leadership.

[VintageKrug]

If you believe BA’s figures are manipulated, challenge them via the Stock Exchange.

[CallMeIshmael]

You are a card Krug, I guess you believed the hospital waiting list from the previous government too – the reported figures were accurate, pity the plethora of people excluded from joining the queue; or the Rail companies who changed the definition of “Late Arrivals” when it looked to bad – hey presto it worked – trains upto 9 mins late were no longer defined as late.

So what is the definition of a cancelled flight? – Is it cancelled if it was merged with another, or withdrawn more than 24 hours before schedule take-off? Is it cancelled if it takes off but has no passengers aboard as there are insufficient cabin crew but the plane needs to be down route to pick-up stranded passengers and crew?

Maybe you have never heard of off balance sheet accounting; paying debts early and deferring income – was that how Walsh managed to engineer a crisis with his “fight for survival”? Problem is with that type of manipulation you can only do it once, then it catches up with you .. oh yes then less than a year later it did!

Having weathered volcanoes and the worst IR on record BA still manged to report a nice profit and Walsh awarded a 11% pay increase plus a bonus of £1.63 million. Pretty galling for the hundreds of staff suckered into giving up a weeks pay to save the company.

Brilliant leadership or manipulation?… I’ll ponder that and reflect on the facts on the ground.

Krug, being so highly informed, has there been an airline who has been fined more than BA for corrupt practices across the world; lost more than BA in fuel hedging; embarrassed a nation more – than BA with the T5 debacle; had such an abysmal IR and IA record than BA? Had books published about its “Dirty Tricks” (surely if they were lies BA would have sued and the book withdrawn)

What is the common trait here….. ah the leadership. Guess you won’t get it though.

Keep on paddling and pedalling…

[VintageKrug]

Again the typical BASSA strategy of avoiding the issue and diverting onto other irrelevant areas.

It is no wonder many Cabin Crew are unable to see the wood for the trees in this dispute. Thankfully the majority remain supportive of the company which pays their wages, their former colleagues pensions, and provides employment to tens of thousands of people and will not vote to support this action.

[Hippocampus]

“Compare that with easyjet where 9 out of 10 employees are flying. BA has gone some way to reduce to huge non front line overhead and they have still a significant way to go”

An entirely misleading comparison that gets trotted out time and time again. Easyjet outsources its ground operations. BA employs its own ground staff at LGW, LHR and many other bases.

You are also comparing apples and oranges (excuse the pun). Easyjet is a short-haul point-to-point carrier, with one class of product, no alliance membership/partnerships, no frequent flyer programme, with one channel to market. BA is a completely different business.

[CallMeIshmael]

Krug – the issue is appalling corrupt and incompetent leadership which has got BA into this mess across the board – the appalling IR and IA is symptomic of appalling leadership.

Solve the leadership issue and you solve the IR and IA issue – amongst others.

Again, am pleading for you to enlighten me, has there been an airline who has been fined more than BA for corrupt practices across the world; lost more than BA in fuel hedging; embarrassed a nation more – than BA with the T5 debacle; had such an abysmal IR and IA record than BA? Had books published about its “Dirty Tricks” (surely if they were lies BA would have sued and the book withdrawn).

[VintageKrug]

British Airways management controls British Airways and not BASSA.

BA Management has demonstrated its ability to negotiate with Unions, from BALPA to the Unite itself in settling the T5 ground-based crew issues, and also in agreeing a satisfactory resolution to the pensions deficit.

BASSA has refused to negotiate with British Airways, and is even in dispute with its own Union parent. Hardly competent.

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