BA after swallowing bmi

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  • Hippocampus
    Participant

    NewBAexec, Air France is probably not the best airline to look at as a model for IAG strategy. It has, by some considerable distance, the highest net debt of any of the three European majors. It is now cutting routes and is probably about 10 years behind BA in terms of restructuring itself.

    Network planning know what they are doing. Do not underestimate how much analysis goes into asset utilisation and route performance and the importance of the golden rule of airline economics: unprofitable growth destroys value.


    KeaneJohn
    Participant

    NewBAexec

    BA have dropped their Detroit and Charlotte routes (even then disastrous USAirways venture). BA have also dropped their Gatwick Zurich route and I am sure that they also used to fly to CDG from there as well.

    On the subject of Paris and Brussels if you are close to the airport you can be at Ashford International or Ebbsfeet International to pick up the Eurostar with door to door times very competitive to flying (and this is a person speaking that loves flying).

    In my mind, having lived and worked in Jersey for a few years using LGW pretty much all the time it was a horrible airport to use. Not sure if that is still the case. I know its had a revamp but Fast Track Security was always a joke often taking nearly an hour to get to the lounge from the check-in desk.

    Carribbean routes are very much leisure traffic with few requirements for connecting flights from within Europe. I would expect that most people from the UK.

    As other people have mentioned, BA already have some spare slots that they could use and I am sure BA know what they will do when they acquire BMI.

    It will be very interesting to see what BA do with BMI and I have yet to see anything about BMIbaby or BMI Regional.


    sparkyflier
    Participant

    I believe the price BA will pay for BMI will come down somewhat if LH has still not offloaded BMI baby. About Regional, I thought this had already been agreed months ago, but maybe has fallen through?

    Re routes to Detroit & Charlotte, well the Detroit economy is picking up to some extent, however this might be a route best started with an AA 757 as part of thier joint venture. Charlotte, not so sure about.

    Going back to the posting by Hippocampus about AF not being the best example for IAG, I believe it is the European routes that are losing them lots of money, and the long haul not so bad, however perhaps starting new routes with high density 777-300s was not that well thought out. KLM however is doing rather well, and keeping the whole AF/KLM show on the road! And their long haul expansion has been very ambitious…

    On Caribbean routes, I think the Nassau/Grand Cayman/Providenciales routes are kept at LHR as one or all of their runways cannot take a 777, and only have length for 767. I think 2/3 767s could go to Gatwick, and I understood from other threads last year that BA was ready to go ahead with that, before the BMI situation started to become a possibility.

    I think leisure routes need to be approached with caution on capacity, but some new routes could be combined with exisiting to test the water. How about moving Port of Spain (currently from LGW via St Lucia), oil hub. moving to LHR and then having a 90 minute extension to Bogota.

    Also with Malaysian joining Oneworld,a daily 777 to KL, codeshared with MH, and then a flight going to Jakarta 4 times a week, and Bali 3 times a week, I am sure could be successful. It could work this time verus 10 years ago as more fuel efficient aircraft, MH feed and more efficient scheduling of flights.


    dutchyankee
    Participant

    @sparkyflyer, I think you are correct regarding the aircraft serving Grand Cayman and Providenciales as their runway lengths are just over 2100 mtrs and just over 2300 mtrs respectively. As both destinations are served via Nassau, perhaps there is also a weight limitation of either or both runways.


    ChrisBuda82
    Participant

    Think it been said before, If i was BA I would cut the amount of routes that double up with BMI put bigger planes on the routes and fly less would be a big saving and free up slots for the far east that are lacking in the UK. Like the idea of Gatwick being the leisure hot spot, but Gatwick is getting better but is a pain to get from Surrey and Hampshire. Would mean less planes int he air the Greens would love that!

    I think there need to be big rethink of LHR use of Terminals there maybe the handing over of the new LHR East being given to BA/BMI and One World partners alone with Aer lingus has they have deal with BA. I would still think BA would need T5 or could they use all of East.

    If this would happen T3 could be nocked down, well think that for a other post.

    BMI Regional think woud be good for BA to keep, due think BA made a bad move to sell BA Regional years ago. Flybe is ok but does not have the links with BA.

    BMI baby if there is any good routes they should keep, low cost is very much leisure use so is very up and down. But saying that it far cheaper to fly BA than Easyjet and other. BA made a good job of GO prob was a bad move of them to sell to Easyjet.


    LPPSKrisflyer
    Participant

    So if BA/Oneworld go in to LHR East and take it over in total and T3 is knocked down, where do *A go?


    ChrisBuda82
    Participant

    LPPSKrisflyer LHR East is being built in two parts So BA/One world could move in to the new part What is on the site of the old T2 and the Star people could stay in T1 until T3 is rebuilt? Hoping BAA has has used the stacking that is used in T5 as LHR East (South) could be as big as T5 even bigger.

    Lot of middle east Airlines are talking to the UK to get the third runway built, what would even better hole new Terminals could be built between the third and the 2nd runway.


    Hippocampus
    Participant

    Regarding terminal moves, IAG has expressed a desire for the additioonal BA/bmi capacity to be accommodated in Terminal 3 with other Oneworld partners. BA will no doubt remain in Terminal 5 given the investment made in the terminal.


    transtraxman
    Participant

    Taken from BAA´s website

    “Terminal 2 has been demolished and will be replaced with a brand new building. The new terminal will be the eventual home of the Star Alliance,…”

    “We also have plans to replace the building(T1) completely around 2019…”

    With regards to T3 there is no future investment mentioned. However, I have always understood that T3 is for all ONEWORLD airlines plus some non-alliance members, as is the case at T4 with Skyteam.
    This situation could change with Iberia transfering to T5 and JAL was promised the possibility to transfer to T5 as the price to pay for it staying in ONEWORLD.

    The question is, which airlines will transfer to the new T1 after 2019? Will Virgin Atlantic still be around to go there? Will the terminal be used for non-alliance airlines? Will there be any airlines outside alliances then? Will there be a fourth or even fifth alliance? – El Al is even now making tentative attempts to form a fourth alliance.


    sparkyflier
    Participant

    Is that right transtaxman? El Al wanting to form an alliance? Do you know who with. I guess IR wont be on their list!

    Does anyone out there know why BA do not have any “triangle routes”, except for when there are operational aspects like civil unrest etc? This is a way of serving 2 destinations, and if not trying to get local traffic (2 way), keeping fuel costs as well as landing charges down.

    Are there union agreements that prevent this?

    Re BMI regional, could this be ideal to keep, to try and avoid the “London Airways” impression, as well as providing same brand feed.

    Going back to NewBA and the suggestions about USA routes – Minneapolis, not sure if there is sufficient traffic for this, and it is a Delta hub, who have a good product. Detroit I already agreed with you, but maybe on a AA757, Charlotte – anyone know whow well the US Airways flight fills up? Fort Lauderdale I agree – easy 3-4 times a week on 767 and maybe as loads of cruise shipping traffic, 777.

    I know Air Seychelles are leaving UK, do you think there would be enough traffic to do that flight on its own. Competition is now Etihad & Emirates. And Male in Maldives, could this be increased, and maybe with a 4 class 777? Are SriLankan leaving the route? And Colombo, I wonder if this could come back from LGW?


    dutchyankee
    Participant

    @sparkyflyer,

    http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/el-al-plans-to-forge-new-alliance-with-three-initial-partners-346231/

    While a number of airlines including El Al flew between Tehran and Tel Aviv during the times of the Shah, I think you are correct that IR wouldn’t be on their list at this time!!


    ChrisBuda82
    Participant

    transtraxman The plans for LHR East where done when BMI was not going to be part of BA, things have changed now, IAG will have 56% of the slots at LHR that is not adding in Oneworld. So big rethink is need as dont think they can fit all of Oneworld in T3 and T5, T5 as known will be BA only they are not willing or letting any one else use it. IB and JAL use of T5 is just some press crap.

    So with 56% IAG (BA,BMI, IB) + oneworld LHR East seems the best option for them, like I said before LHR East (South exT1) could be used by T3 airlines and T3 rebuilt we known it all it need to be done and does not make sense that when Full LHR East (South and North are) built that the Star A will use a that spare 50% or or sightly higher. T2 Could be used until T3 is fixed.


    Hippocampus
    Participant

    IB and JL moving to Terminal 5 is most certainly not “just some press crap”.

    BA moved its Madrid services to T5 last year. IB is expected to follow at some point once system/process issues are resolved as T5 was set up purely for BA processes. It may not happen but it there has definitely been a project to look into it.

    Similarly, JAL was offered a move to T5 as part of a package to keep it in Oneworld when it was looking at moving alliances. BA and JAL are expected to set up a joint business to Japan and JAL moving to T5 is still on the agenda AFAIK.


    BTBAsccm
    Participant

    IB move into T5 is this year, believe it to be for summer 2012 ops.


    transtraxman
    Participant

    By looking at the BAA site(about Heathrow) again I find that there are two airlines that will transfer from T4 to T3 after they join oneworld – Kingfisher and Malaysia (MAS). TAM would also be on the list if it decides to join its merger partner LAN in oneworld.
    BMI flights would (could??) be absorbed by T5 and T3.

    However, the biggest movement is waiting to happen in the other direction 9 airlines of Star Alliance want to join their partners in T1 (from T3) but will have to wait till T2 is opened. United´s merger partner, Continental, is still in T4 so will want to transfer too (to T1).

    With BMI moving out of T1 some transfers might well be possible but we know that it is not a question of simple arithmetic. Are the gates available for the types of aircraft flown and at the times wanted? Also off-stand parking is possible with passengers bussed out to the aircraft, but is there enough space for that near T1?

    Things will not get sorted out completely until both T1 and T2 are rebuilt.

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