[FaroFlyer]

[postquote quote=998437][/postquote]

Hi Simon,

Not saying that 2/3 would make any difference. Just informing what Portuguese Government says about repatriation flights. Basically just be grateful you’re on one.

In some ways we should appreciate that a Government is actually doing something, rather than dither and delay.

[MartynSinclair]

Just to put context into words that have been written – and keeping to the airline mentioned in this thread.

Review the seat maps from the BA website (i realise they are probably not to scale, but it certainly puts things into perspective)

https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb/information/seating/seat-maps/euro-traveller-seatmap

Compare the maps of the LCY A318 to the A319. Despite having vastly fewer seats, the A318, still does probably not conform to social distanced seats, unless you are travelling with your wife/partner or child.

As for the 777’s being used on the repatriation flights… who wouldn’t take the last seat today on a crammed full flight that needs to get back to UK?

Perhaps a more interesting thread going forward would be thoughts on flying pre vaccine / treatment for this and other virus’s. What should the airlines and airports do, to keep passengers safe on the basis that social distancing is something that cant be achieved when flying or on public transport in general.

[SimonS1]

[quote quote=998448]What should the airlines and airports do, to keep passengers safe on the basis that social distancing is something that cant be achieved when flying or on public transport in general.[/quote]

My personal view is nothing, other than obvious things like temperature screening on access to the airport which can be done en masse without causing delay.

To my knowledge no-one is ever forced to get on an aircraft, so this is a risk to be weighed up by the individual. If I take a flight I shouldn’t complain afterwards….in other words put up or shut up.

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K1ngston, cwoodward, Johnnyg, Montysaurus, canucklad, ASK1945

[MartynSinclair]

[quote quote=998451]My personal view is nothing, other than obvious things like temperature screening on access to the airport which can be done en masse without causing delay.[/quote]

I think the above may be the version of ‘safety/protection’ for passengers flying in and out of the UK – but IMHO, I fear a post 9/11 situation where the rest of the world will go into overdrive and enforce all sorts of restrictions for anyone wishing to cross borders. This is already evidenced by the way borders are being managed, in vastly different ways by Governments & countries around the world.

[quote quote=998451]If I take a flight I shouldn’t complain afterwards….in other words put up or shut up.[/quote]

It’s not about complaining afterwards, its more about understanding what to expect before you buy the ticket. In order to weigh up the risks you need to know the facts. Clearly, some passengers on the highly published Air Lingus flight and some passengers on the repatriation flights could only show concern once on board. Being made to keep social distancing marching through the airport and out to the flight, it is easy for some passengers to assume the flight would have been operated differently.

It will be interesting to learn the choices we as a group of travellers will make once the world reopens.

1 user thanked author for this post.

ASK1945

[SimonS1]

[quote quote=998457]It’s not about complaining afterwards, its more about understanding what to expect before you buy the ticket. In order to weigh up the risks you need to know the facts. Clearly, some passengers on the highly published Air Lingus flight and some passengers on the repatriation flights could only show concern once on board. Being made to keep social distancing marching through the airport and out to the flight, it is easy for some passengers to assume the flight would have been operated differently.[/quote]

Dangerous assumption there Martyn. I would have thought anyone with half a brain and a basic knowledge of the inside of an aircraft (steel tube) would realise that it just wouldn’t work on board.

So when buying a ticket the obvious thought process is “I am going to be stuck in a confined space with other people, can I handle that?”. As I said up thread even reducing the capacity by a third doesnt make a meaningful difference, and if you reduce further then clearly basic economics comes into play.

That’s why people need to think first not complain after.

The point about common standards is an interesting one, I suspect in reality there will be a supply and demand issue. If places like Kenya (where I travel a lot) introduce unrealistic guidelines about health certificates etc I will just give it a miss. At a time when countries will need to attract not discourage visitors some calm thinking may be in order.

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K1ngston, Montysaurus

[capetonianm]

I hope it’s not inappropriate to post this here and if it is then will a mod please delete it.

I refer to my earlier posting #998383 about repatriation flights from Lagos. These are 4 seamen stranded in Lagos and have no means of getting home. Most of us know that Nigeria is not a safe or pleasant place at any time, least of all now. They have tried to get a response from the FCO and have got nowhere. I and a colleague in the travel industry spent collectively 4 or 5 hours yesterday trying to get them flights home, even via X and Y. There aren’t any bookable for weeks.

I doubt if signing the petition will achieve anything but it won’t do any harm and will show support for these men who must be feeling utterly miserable and despondent. Thank you.

https://www.change.org/p/uk-parliament-get-us-home

We are 4 British Divers/Seamen standed in Lagos, Nigeria without any means to return home to our families and the relative safety from the world pandemic of covid 19. One member of our group is getting on in years and suffers from asthma. The situation in Nigeria is deteriorating every day and the spread of the virus unstoppable due to poor healthcare and lockdown procedures. We are living in a metal container on the deck of a ship in the port of Lagos without any support from our government and unable to contact anyone to speak to. We have been told the final repatriation flight is leaving today 8.05.20 and we are not on it with no other flights planned. All we want is to go home. Please sign our petition and help us to see our families again

[MartynSinclair]

[quote quote=998459]Dangerous assumption there Martyn. I would have thought anyone with half a brain and a basic knowledge of the inside of an aircraft (steel tube) would realise that it just wouldn’t work on board.[/quote]

Oh dear SimonS1, you appear to be in one of your objectionable moods again. If you are in the UK, calm down, get out of the sun and pour yourself a G & T.

Whilst I agree social distancing on aeroplanes is virtually impossible (as reinforced by seats maps shown earlier) – but perhaps anyone with half a brain and a very basic knowledge of the inside of an aircraft (steel tube), would assume some precautions were being implemented for a repatriation flight needed during a world wide pandemic, currently killing thousands of people.

[SimonS1]

[postquote quote=998462][/postquote]

Well I imagine those operating the flights have considered the risks and decided the need to repatriate as many people as possible back to the UK (like the ones capetonianm refers to above) outweighs the need to keep people 2 meters apart or alternatively leave them behind.

As for being objectionable, well certain posters amongst us seem to have complained persistently for weeks on end….why are airports letting people back in, why are people flying to Israel for a new job (complete with a total misinterpretation of government advice on essential travel), why isn’t social distancing being practiced on board aircraft etc etc.

In such a high risk environment I can see for some people self isolation may continue for….ever. Alternatively a bit of positivity may assist?

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Montysaurus

[capetonianm]

Apparently there are 456 people listed for evacuation from Lagos but no plans yet to bring them back. How difficult is it to charter two flights, they could even get them all on a 380 if they have any ready to fly? HMG will charge the passengers a realistic fare so no financial loss.

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ASK1945, SimonS1

[GBAIR72]

No one is forcing anyone to travel. Most businesses travel can be avoided by using video conferencing. The lockdown has proved this.
I am flying next week as relocating (albeit temporarily) to Gibraltar to look after the family. I have assessed the risk of doing this now. This is on me not the airline. So what I have done rather than fly in club it was the same price to buy 4 seats in economy. Purchase 4 tickets for seats 11A 12A 13A and 12B. This way I won’t have anyone near me. In these unusual circumstances I can as load factors are not very high.

However when the restrictions are lifted It will not be viable to operate any flight with social distancing measures. Either the seat is empty in the middle and prices go way way high or back to normal flying. What people do for a cheap ticket is they take the risk.

I think the bigger problem is on trains and public transport. If it is tough to do it on a plane god knows how this will work on the London Underground. I will not commute on public transport until there is a vaccine

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ASK1945, SimonS1

[MartynSinclair]

[quote quote=998463]As for being objectionable, well certain posters amongst us seem to have complained persistently for weeks on end….why are airports letting people back in[/quote]

Please quote me correctly SimonS1. My concern regarding airports in the UK is the open border policy that has been in place since the beginning of the year allowing over 18.1 million passengers into the UK (up to lockdown day), no medical questions asked. This open border policy is unique to the UK & remains in place today, the day the number of deaths has reached over 31,000. which is now second largest number in the world, only behind the USA. It’s positive to know the Government are considering among other things a quarantine option for arriving passengers.

We are all a very friendly bunch on here SimonS1, indeed I thanked you last week when you educated me about essential travel and the FCO definition in relation to International travel.

If I have upset or offended you, I will happily meet up for a drink/break bread to apologise, of course when Boris allows :). The BT team have my details.

1 user thanked author for this post.

ASK1945

[SimonS1]

[quote quote=998469]My concern regarding airports in the UK is the open border policy that has been in place since the beginning of the year allowing over 18.1 million passengers into the UK (up to lockdown day), no medical questions asked. This open border policy is unique to the UK[/quote]

But of those 18m, about 12m were in Jan and Feb (and that was Heathrow only) and another 3m in March. It really is extremely misleading to say that 18m people came in due to a policy was unique to UK, since in those months most other borders were also open, for example of the places I visited in Q1 Dubai borders didn’t close until 24/3, Kenya 22/3, Ghana 25/3, USA 14/3, India 12/3.

In fact I don’t remember you or anyone else expressing much concern on here before mid March either? After all we can all be wise after the event.

Added to which many of the people returning are people being repatriated who cannot be refused access.

It’s not a question of upset or offence, just that I think the argument has to stand up to scrutiny.

I am sure in the fullness of time there will be plenty of lessons to be learnt but I haven’t seen any evidence that the relatively small number of people entering the UK have made a massive difference to case numbers. However clearly if measures are to be eased and passenger numbers ramped up then additional measures may be justified.

1 user thanked author for this post.

ASK1945

[SimonS1]

When heading to the shops today I found that buses were replacing trains on the Lewes line.

The bus was blocking the road and while stationary I watched 4 passengers join, all passing within 2 meters of the driver in his seat. There was no social distancing on the bus as people were clearly sat in adjoining rows.

Clearly this is an international outrage, I would urge that all buses are immediately taken off the road. I’m sure my neighbours can walk 4 or 5 miles each way to town or the nearest rail station.

Honestly. What is the world coming to when such things are allowed to happen.

[K1ngston]

[postquote quote=998459][/postquote]

I agree with you Simon, as I stated in a previous thread, people are wise enough to make decisions for themselves including getting on a plane or not, if that is safe or not, for me its the only way to kick start or we are going to be talking like this for a very long time! But to your point any travel I make will absolutely ensure that I do not go into 14 days isolation upon my arrival as that will negate the reason for travelling, so it is dependent on countries to make those decisions.

[K1ngston]

[postquote quote=998469][/postquote]

Martyn, let me try and adjudicate here if I may, the fundamental difference between your POV and Simon’s is that he is trying to look at this from a futuristic perspective as I am doing, the facts about SD and about the number of people coming into the country to this point is immaterial in my humble opinion, its what can be done now to drag us all out the malaise that many individuals and Governments have found themselves in.

For me, we need to be thinking about the future how do we address the issue by moving forward, or in simple terms the cup half full as opposed to half empty! I know you very well and we have broken bread many times and will continue to do so, if people dont drive forward and ensure post COVID happens then we may never get the opportunity to do so again!

To be clear and to make sure there is no doubt, I will be one of the first people to get back on the horse when borders open, I have agreed with the restrictions here in Asia and they have made a difference but we have to now move on, I totally understand the “risks” that others suggest but to move things forward I will accept those risks. If we dont start mingling how can we find the immunity needed?

We live in unprecedented times and to go forward from here, some will lead some will follow and some will remain static, I am not knocking any of these important decisions being made by people all over the world but recognize they are made by intelligent people looking out for themselves and their families and I respect them all!

[Author]

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