[Alsacienne]

“Inconvenience” – door…….horse …..bolted…

But one can – or should be able to – learn from the past ….

And yes, the title of the thread is illadvised, hence my post for clarification.

The fact that many of the members of this community are ‘business’ travellers does not exclude them from being patient or considerate … and they might like to add a little slack in their busy travel schedules if possible to reduce their stress levels, and for those travelling in France or through France, to get some current idea of what to expect.

[SimonS1]

Martyn – unfortunately one of the limitations of BT software is even the original poster cannot change the title subsequently. But the borders were shut when I posted it.

I agree with you on the rest though. With hundreds of thousands of homeless people wandering uncontrolled through the heart of Europe, quite possibly infiltrated by IS, it was inevitable we would at some stage find ourselves in this position.

None of it, it must be said, helped by our own foreign policy which left behind chaos in places like Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan.

[SimonS1]

@Alsacienne – it wasn’t ill advised when I posted – the French borders were temporarily closed and at least one flight from US cancelled as a result.

We can all be wise after the event. As some EU leaders will find as they scramble chaotically to reintroduce border controls. In the UK we are all used to “inconvenience” at borders, at least it provides a degree of control, we learnt our lessons many years ago from episodes like 7/7.

Thank heavens we never participated in the great Shenghen experiment.

[Alsacienne]

“Shenghen”??? Is that somewhere in China that I’ve not heard of as yet!! ;-).

My apologies if the word ‘ill-advised’ was incorrect at the time you posted. Mind you, the UK newspapers I read very early this morning seemed to have problems in distinguishing between closed borders and border controls …

But no one can be complacent …

“we learnt our lessons many years ago from episodes like 7/7.” …

as evil also evolves and we cannot always predict just how low humanity will sink.

As I said, I was only trying to guide travellers in and through France. It was far from my intent to cause a dispute.

[SimonS1]

Thank you Alsacienne. I see you have now changed tack to inject some humour to a subject that couldn’t be more sombre. Ill advised might be more appropriate there.

I suspect when the papers went to press the borders were closed but people here are very familiar with border controls as fortunately we didn’t give them up as part of the European master plan.

I’m sure you understand what was meant by Shengen (corrected) but it’s the porous border model that allows thousands of Syrians, Iraqis etc to pour into Greece and end up in Paris with little or no control. Seems a Syrian passport has already been found on the body of one of tha attackers. Quelle surprise.

[seasonedtraveller]

After an extremely long journey home to the UK, I have just woken up to this awful news.
A shocking sign of the times.
Very sad.

[FDOS_UK]

SimonS1 – 14/11/2015 13:24 GMT

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/27055108

It’s not just a Schengen problem, although I agree that the free movement is not currently helping.

[canucklad]

Sangatte is the biggest monument to Schengen and more importantly the naive failings of political ideologically turned into dogmatism….

Worse still, it should have been a warning to these politicians who cow tow to the realities of sharing our planetl with pure evil.

[LuganoPirate]

Schengen was a good idea but until the EU could secure all its borders, southern and eastern, it should have stayed just that, an idea. The trouble is politicians say they are doing what the people want and what is good for them. The reality is they rarely act in the interest of the people but rather in their own interest and their self aggrandisement!

[SimonS1]

Of course it isn’t solely a Schengen problem but when your borders are open to all comers from other parts of Europe then it will always be a problem nonetheless as you are only as strong as your weakest link. In France’s case that isn’t very strong, you only have to see how weak and spineless the French are in Calais to realise that.

Gradually the whole edifice is crumbling though, places like Sweden and even Germany have had to introduce some form on controls. Sadly as Martyn says the horse has long since bolted though.

[MartynSinclair]

Sky News now reporting (from AP source):

“Greek Minister says one Paris assailant entered the EU through Greece in Early October”.. Kay Burley confirming he was a Syrian refugee..

Germany should also now feel very concerned…. the way Frau Merkel opened their borders and invited all and sundry in with no checks…

[PatJordan]

Mrs. J and I are just back from a (partly aborted) weekend in Paris. We returned to Hilton CDG @ 10PM Friday 13th, exhausted after a day in Disney Paris, to learn of the dreadful events in Paris City.

Shortly after midnight, we learned of the closing of borders, and fully expected our flight home (Saturday 14th) to be in jeopardy. TV news reports were increasingly worrying. Eventually, we drifted to sleep…….

and awoke to see a wonderful view from our hotel window: aircraft landing and departing from CDG.

With the prospect of a delayed flight, I asked about a late check out. No problem at all, I was given the room until 6pm, with the offer of even later if we needed it. And at no charge. Well done Hilton CDG.

I contacted Aer Lingus, who changed our flight home to an earlier one, again at no charge, given the circumstances.

Arriving at CDG T1 @ 11am was like a vision of hell. All passengers were funneled towards a single channel to departures, leading to delays of over an hour to clear passport control.

Our flight was slightly delayed, but remained on stand to facilitate the many pax delayed.

Never before were Mrs J & I so happy to get home from a trip away.

Aer Lingus did trojan work getting people back to Dublin, and the Hilton CDG were very decent too.

Whatever criticisms might be directed at the CDG staff, it cannot be forgotten that they performed their duty in the face of huge personal turmoil after the events of Friday 13th.

Unlike many others, we are safely home: for this I am very thankful.

[SimonS1]

Indeed Martyn. There was an air of inevitability that at least one of the people behind this would have been an illegal, migrant, refugee, asylum seeker or whatever the PC term is these days.

Hollande, Merkel and co must surely see that ‘le grand experiment’ has been a big failure and left their own nationals dead on the streets.

[Author]

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