You are here: Discussion » All airlines »
Have flown 4 sectors in F over the last few months and during all of my travels, including todays, the flight crew (in full uniform), were using rows 4 and 5 as a rest area. I really think this looks tacky and unprofessional and undermines the premium nature of the F cabin.
Anyone else had similar experiences?
In some cases, the number of flight deck crew working some LH routes outward are different from the number required working on the return leg. These flight deck are "dead heading". Sticking them in a crew rest area is not always possible as this is required for operating/ working crew.
Other cases may be crews positioning. They could even be the whole flight crew from another airline positioning.
Were these "mini sectors" on fifth freedom flights (e.g. Muscat-Abu Dhabi)?
That's the only time I've seen this; didn't bother me.
A Captain will need to answer that BB. Though if you have seen the Leonardo diCaprio film "Catch me if you can" he was always uniformed when "positioning" on TWA for Pan Am. (He never piloted an aircraft)
It was on LHR - DEL, DEL-LHR, LHR - JFK, JFK - LHR
They already have a Club rest seat upstairs and a rest area so don't really see why they need to be in F.
Because dead heading or not they are still crew. Will use the crew lanes at immigration and emigration or may even be flying to replace an incapacitated crew.
In some professions you're still "on duty" even when "off duty".
Personally it does not bother me and I often end up chatting with them. Recently meeting some crew we discovered we had a mutual friend who is a senior captain with KLM.
I've never seen it on BA.
On US carriers, I've seen it plenty of times, esp. cabin crew who are commuting home.
Ok. LHR-JFK has two pilots which is the minimum crew so whoever was in First was not part of the operating crew. They may have been positioning out to cover for sickness etc.
LHR-DEL, DEL-LHR does not have a Club seat upstairs for the crew.
Oh dear me, some contributors on this forum need to " wise up " as they say in Northern Ireland.Objecting to the presence of uniformed flight crew in any cabin seems strange; they are usually sober, reserved in manner and pleasantly communicative when engaged by passengers.
And they , and their colleagues, are responsible for the safety of crew and passengers. A sense of perspective is needed.
It could have been caused by an aircraft going tech (breaking down) away from base. The operating crew will then need to be transferred back - still on duty - whilst the aircraft is fixed. A replacement crew would subsequently passenger out - on duty - to collect the fixed aircraft.
On AA it is standard practice 1A is reserved as a crew rest. The third pilot rests their during the flight. That way you get a rested pilot at the top of their game when it comes to approach and landing. I would rather have a flight crew firing on all cylinders rather than consigning them to Business or Coach so my ego is suitably flattered.
Only ever seen Flight crew in uniform not flying and that was BA. Sat in Seat in front of Colin Marshall on flight back from GRU a couple of years back. Not even aware of him on plane but the bowing and scraping from everyone within 50 yds the minute we entered T5 was unbelievable. Passed pleasantries in the elevator (escaltors are too slow), he seemed perfectly normal chap. But the way all the BA suits came runnign out to bow and scrape you would think it was the second coming. He wasn't wearing a uniform though so I guess off topic.
Crew in F on AA is not common but AA HQ management is very very common. Let's hope they cut these perks as part of CHapter 11.
On Continental's B757-200ER seat 1B is often reserved for pilot relief, no issue for me.
I am glad that Airline Captains don't act like cruise ship Captains when they need to be at the top of their game.
Rich, interested in your comment, (2 above) about flight crew resting to be at the top of their game on approach and landing.
I do think a sense of proportion is needed here. Pilots are highly trained, undergo frequent check rides (3 sim check failures = no 4th attempt), have plenty of time off and time out, including being paid to sleep whilst actually working! There are generally 2 of them working the approach and landing, plus there is the auto pilot/flight director; exactly how relaxed and wrapped up in cotton wool do you think these guys and girls need to be?
Nothing to do with ego's but I think uniformed staff in F is out of place on a long haul.
Martyn I disagree. If you are talking about short longhauls like East Coast or Middel East i.e. 6-7 hours then it is not necessary. If you are flying to LAX, EZE, NRT or similar length routes i.e 10 hours plus then I want them rested and not fatigued, particularly on red eye flights where exhaustion acts quicker.
Coming into LHR or other equally busy fields with protracted holding and heavy traffic after a 10 or 11 hour overnight flight, I do not think you can be too careful.
As for the airline suits, I would kick them all out of First tomorrow. I know we have previously disagreed on the value of pilots. What your logic omits to account for is that Pilots no matter how well trained and how competent are still human beings and as such fallable. There are far too many cases where pilot error and fatigue still cause incidents and I welcome anything that makes us even a bit safer .
On some LH 777/767 that do not have crew rest areas... And when a Heavy crew are carried, they are entitled to crew rest in 1st class seats ... And they are operating crew, hence why in uniform .
On the basis that pilots are still human in terms of errors, how far would you go in terms of freshness on landing, On a 10 hour plus sector, may be its safer to fly with 2 complete crews??
Some times being too comfortable and relaxed makes you less able to make the correct calls.
10 hour + sectors on a corporate jet is probably slightly worse in terms of available cabin space than 10 hour + sectors on the heavies. Pilots though in the world of corporate aviation don't moan nearly as much and do not need to be wrapped up in cotton wool as much as prima donna airline pilots.
I agree Rich, rest is crucial, what I disagree about is the degree of rest that is really needed.
Martynsinclair... HORIZONTAL REST... is a legal requirement for CAA registered and licenced flight crew...
Most of the time corporate airlines have there aircraft registered OUSIDE the UK so are not covered by these rules..
Now don't get me wrong, I am not the biggest fan of flight crew.. But they are entitled to the HORIZONTAL rest...
TOP SECTIONS »
Business Traveller offers tried-and-tested tips on getting more for your money. This month: communication
Read more »
Stats presented in illuminating ways. This month: BRIC flights from Europe
Read more »
Tired of flying? Let the train take the strain. Alex McWhirter suggests ten trips linking major cities
Read more »
