Cantona07 - 30/01/2012 09:29 GMT
Last night I returned from Tel Aviv together with my wife from a customer’s wedding over the weekend, I was sat in WTP (row 22 J&K) in front of me over the isles in row 21 were two German businessmen who decided to talk very loudly during the safety demonstration.
I do find this most disrespectful to the crew (who were probably only 4ft away in the door between Club and WTP, I looked at the stewardess in an attempt to support her, he looked back with a look of embarrassment, clearly not able to do anything.
I politely touched the loudest of the two on the shoulder and asked them to respect the safety announcement, after a while they final stopped chatting and read their papers!
I was then given horrible looks for the flight as if I had a major problem or was some kind of rules sergeant!
I am a Gold card holder with both BA and Emirates taking over 150 business flights per year and have noticed that this kind of behaviour is more common with the crew seeming to have little control over such idle chatter.
During the flight I made contact with the stewardess, she told me openly this is a major problem and she could not stop the safety presentation to ask for silence or the likes, the thanked me for my assistance.
Does anyone have any views on this or other experiences? Was I correct to ask for them to stop talking or would it have been better to remain quiet but very frustrated?
Any views most welcome.
BeckyBoop - 30/01/2012 09:42 GMT
Absolutley sick and very distrespectful, and its usually business men and they also read newspapers or books and fly so much they think they know everything :( xx
PatJordan - 30/01/2012 09:56 GMT
Quite aside from the total lack of respect shown by those who make noise during safety announcements, there is a safety issue too:
if (even one) passenger cannot hear the details of the announcement due to others making noise, it places that passenger at risk.
I have seen cabin crew asking passengers to stop talking (in a most respectful way, of course) during the announcement. It had the desired effect too!
It's just like those lounge bores who have to make a racket on their phones.....no, we don't think you're all that important, just an ignoramus.
Pat
Cantona07
In my experience, the only airline who reacts is Ryanair, where I have seen frequent (but not comprehensive) interventions by the SCCM to the effect that this is for your safety, be quiet.
The crew are there for your safety, they should intervene.
Personally, I would not have taken your course of action, but to be clear I don't criticise you for this.
I hold a PPL and the air law is the same as for the airline industry. If I had fet so strongly, I would have rung the call bell after the briefing, said that I could not hear for these Germans and therefore had not received a briefing.
This is mandatory and the cabin crew would then have to give you a 1-2-1 briefing, which they would not like as it would slow them down. It would get your point across in a way that no-one could criticise as disruptive behaviour.
But I do sympathise with your frustration and in taking action, you at least struck a blow for safety, rather than sitting there and fuming.
openfly - 30/01/2012 10:57 GMT
An interesting thread. By coincidence I flew BA short haul yesterday and there were so many chatters and paper readers during the safety demo, that at the end of the demo, the purser cam e on the PA and announced that 'as so many passengers were unaware of the importance of the safety video, she was going to repeat it'..and did, loudly! Just about every body paid attention.
I congratulated her for her courage, as it delayed the take off, but she said that the captain had totally agreed with her actions. Bravo.
esselle - 30/01/2012 13:07 GMT
I cannot abide the growing number of arrogant (and ignorant) folk frequently encountered on airliners these days who think the rules do not apply to them. Be it phones, belts, safety briefings or generally borish behaviour, they consider themselves so important that doing things as they should be done does not apply.
In these circumstances, crew should be expected to take a firm line, and they should also have the right to expect passengers to support them.
JordanD - 30/01/2012 16:36 GMT
Can't fail to praise the Crew that openfly mentions - I'd take a delay over an unsafe process any day.
There was, late last year, a similar thread on FlyerTalk, which discussed the issue of persons not listening to the safety briefing and then being given a 'stern' talking to for not listening (which in that case was justified, as the person not listening was on an exit row); I think the general feeling is that if people don't listen to the safety briefing, stop, call them out 'by name' (i.e. "will the gentleman currently talking, please stop") wait for them to stop and then carry on.
They won't make the mistake twice to talk through the briefing.
I can understand those pax who fly so often with the same aircraft type that they probably know the safety briefing by heart. However that is no excuse for talking loudly so others who may not be habitual travellers cannot hear the briefing!
I was on LH a few weeks ago, an A320 I think and the crew were doing the safety demo rather than a video. There was the (now) usual amount of talking and ignoring it.
The purser stopped and announced in both German and English that she would be starting again once she had the full attention of everyone on board and that included the man in 5C who was reading a magazine - I was in 1C! She also added that she would not inform the captain that the cabin was secure for take off until the safety demonstration was completed to her satisfaction.
There was silence while the demo was carried out and at the end, I and a number of others applauded her. Service for the rest of the flight was superb.
NTarrant - 30/01/2012 17:07 GMT
It is complete disrespect for both fellow passengers and cabin crew. Usually its the ones that don't travel as often that think they know it all. It doesn't take any time to just stop what you are doing, talking or reading for a few moments. Doesn't matter if you have heard it all before.
KeaneJohn - 30/01/2012 18:13 GMT
I have flown 4 times since Thursday all on the same aircraft type and have paid full attention to the safety briefings which have been videos.
A lot of passengers do still talk and read during this which I find disrespectful. In the event of an emergency people could have missed out on vital information.
I think more crew should re-do the safety demonstrations once the cabin is quiet, possibly identifying passengers not paying attention, maybe pointing out that it is an offence to ignore crew member instructions and they require full attention for the briefing.
Whilst I don't agree with reading a paper during the safety briefing, as LP says, there are frequent fliers who can hear the message more than once a day.
HOWEVER, talking and loudly is both rude and disrespectful. Whats even worse, is if children are on board as this sets a terrible example and may explain why some kids behave so badly, after all they are only copying the adults.
I also notice people using ear phones during safety briefings - by not hearing the announcement, it coul dput others in trouble as G-d forbid there was a problem, headless and chicken spring to mind.
Unless CC are given the authority to ensure matters of Air Law are carried out correctly, we may as well just bleat on about it. Credit to the CSD's who have the courage to speak out and well done Ryan Air for doing something right at last!
lloydah - 30/01/2012 18:40 GMT
And easyjet. Last flight from Nice the stewardess stopped, asked the two loud females behind me in row 4 to "please pay attention to something that could save your lives." Lots of smiles and "here heres" from the masses.
Kalula safety briefing: "please pay attention to the safety briefing, and that includes all you gents hiding behind your newspapers"!!!
Loyal_BA - 02/02/2012 04:34 GMT
I once saw someone escorted from a plane in China (a british citizen) who refused to listen to the safety briefing. He said that he had heard it more times than the cabin crew. He was then escorted off the plane!
judynagy - 02/02/2012 13:45 GMT
Since good manners seem to be declining everywhere, I think it's important that individuals speak up. You can't wait for "someone in charge" to intervene; they've been taught political correctness and don't want to offend anyone for any reason at all. When I decide to chastise someone for boorish behaviour, I just think of this phrase: "What do I care if they glare at me, I don't know them anyway". If they glare, I just smile at them. Of course, all chastisement must be delivered politely and quietly so as to not exhibit boorish behaviour myself.
RichHI1 - 02/02/2012 13:56 GMT
Whilst I must admot to not listening every time (when I do I find myself repeating it in sync with announcement - I know get a life). HOWEVER I totally agree that people shoudl be respectful of the cabin crew requests and I thought it was great that AA threw Alec Baldwin off a plane for refusing to turn his cellphone off. I would like to see more of this. (I do find the BA policy of not using phones after touchdown very very stupid but if those are the rules you shoudl respect them). I would welcome BA threatening to eject passengers for not complying with crew requirements. (Trouble is we will then get bleating posts about how unfair it is and how the poster is above the rules and been a gold card holder for x years, a personal friend of Will Walsh, COlin MArshall, Lord KIng and the Wright Brothers...)
judy
I really counsel against direct intervention. A passenger has no authority to do this and if things escalate, may be adjudged to be as guilty as the guilty.
All that is needed is a press of the call button and an apologetic "I'm sorry, I couldn't hear the safety briefing for people talking, please will you take me through the key points."
The cabin crew will really not like this, as it will mean they cannot finish their checks, but they they have to do it and will get the message you are sending, but cannot criticise you as you are helping to assure the safety of the aircraft and pax.
if they don't brief you, make a written report to the aviation authority of the carrier, whom I can assure you will take this very seriously.
It is really not smart to become part of a conflict on an aircraft.
RichHI1 - 02/02/2012 15:10 GMT
DoS I think you are right to counsel against direct physical intervention however asking some one to be quiet so you can hear the announcement is not really intervention.
What worries me is the culture that promotes such selfish boorish behaviour. I have to say some of the posts one sees on this site where people are aggrieved the rules were applied to them. About time everyone woke up and learned you are not special or different. Just because we fly in the sharp end of the plane rather than over the wings does not alter the need for respect for others and compliance with reasonable instructions. Throw them off I say...
Sadly, I see this kind of behaviour almost every time that I fly (which is just about every week). I have to say that its a constant source of irritation to me and I have only once seen a crew member (BMI) ask 2 ladies to be quiet so that others could hear properly. Its the same in airport lounges with mobile phone idiots who seem to think the lounge is their personal office & who clearly do not give a toss for those of us who are trying to work or quietly relax.
Back to the original thought, the safety briefing is important & its simply ignorant & disrespectful to ignore the crew no matter how many times you might fly!
On the flip side, the recent introduction of the (frankly awful) safety briefing by Turkish Airlines, which goes on for way to long and is at best, laughable makes a poor situation worse.
I tend to agree with RICH (above) - if they dont shut up, eject them!
