Home@FL350 - 24/03/2010 10:59 GMT
Appears BA have delivered on this earlier threat:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8584720.stm
BA strikers to lose travel perks
Posts
carlton - 24/03/2010 11:15 GMT
BA clearly said that they would remove this perk for the crew that decided to join the strike movement. They had a choice.
"The joint leader of Unite, Tony Woodley, had told strikers on Monday that he believed the long-established discounts were not just a perk but "custom and practice".
I have been split in this dispute as I think both parties have their arguments, some more valid than others, but this is utter nonsense.
The BA staff have become accustomed to this over the years, that does not change the fact that it is still a perk and can be withdrawn at anytime.
I am by no means an expert in strike negotiations however they've lost the plot. At the end of the day, if BA will fail to drastically reduce their costs and get a grip on the pension deficit, there will simply be no BA as we know it today in a few years time.
I guess the question is, do you up your pay and benefits short term or do you try and secure your job long term?
It's sad to see such a great brand diminish into nothingness because of its own employees and their absolute lack of understanding the seriousness of the situation.
BusinessTraveller - 24/03/2010 11:20 GMT
Here is Unite's official press release on the subject - BA has yet to send out a release.
Unite condemns BA's attack on cabin crew travel
Unite has condemned the move by British Airways to withdraw travel benefits from striking cabin crew - many of whom rely on the travel assistance to get to work following BA's decision to close its regional bases and require the vast majority of cabin crew to operate out of Heathrow, no matter where they may live.
Unite said: "This is the clearest possible example of BA's bullying and contemptuous approach to its employees. Cabin crew showed last weekend that they will not be intimidated. Unite will challenge this vindictive move in whatever way seems appropriate."
flier74 - 24/03/2010 12:01 GMT
So Unite, BA are the bullies now are they? I am not working for BA myself but I have a vast number of friends who work as Cabin Crew for BA. Some of them have decided to go to work last weekend and will do so again next weekend. The real bullies are those striking Unite members and the Union Reps who verbally attack any staff who chose to go to work out of a personal choice. I had reports of Crew being sworn at in the Car Park, in Terminal 5, and being verbally abused on social networking sites. So who is the bully then here? All BA Crew knew they would have their staff travel revoked should they go on strike, everyone made their choices, surely not all of them lighthearted but they did. So whatever they chose to do they will now have to face the consequences. End of!
markymark - 24/03/2010 14:36 GMT
At the end of the day, BA is trying everything to intimidate their staff, shouldn't they try to solve the issue in the first place?
As I understand, the perks (which in fact are a good money making scheme for all airlines as it helps them filling empty seats) are discretionary. However, it is illegal to punish staff for participating in a legal strike, and by removing staff travel to those who were in the strike, BA is in effect punishing those staff. (therefore acting illegally)
If the company decided to remove staff travel, then they should do so for everybody not just to those who were legally striking.
Tim2sms - 24/03/2010 14:38 GMT
I assume these perks are taxable at full NI and PAYE rates on the total of the discount?
90% of a F ticket would be a lot of tax.
ichtop1% - 24/03/2010 16:56 GMT
i'm a layman, i'm not in a union and i dont work for an airline. I'm one of those long suffering travellers who get caught up in it all and ultimately one of those who get affected by whatever goes on..........
To Unite and their members on strike............join the real world, take a step back and look at what you're doing to BA and the people you need to have support from....the travelling public, and those who ultimately pay for travel, and your jobs! We're fed up with you and we'll travel with someone else as a result. That will cause passenger numbers to fall, reduce the need for flights, reduce the need for crew and reduce the need for jobs! At what point do you win in that.
To BA - Hold your ground. Reduce your costs, make travel cheaper, increase passenger numbers, increase flights, increase jobs when you can.
As for the latest news on perks, well that's what a perk is.....it's an extra you get if you're lucky, or not foolish enough to jeapordise it.
This country is falling apart again............and i seem to recall it was unions who brought it to it's knees a few years ago by not understanding one of the basic rules of business, you need to cut costs when you're losing money.....or go bust!
And it's just embarrassing to hear union leaders or representatives talk so much rubbish in the media...........seriously, it's embarrassing!
Or am i wrong to speak out of turn!!!!!!!!????? Probably!
markymark - 24/03/2010 17:39 GMT
Well I think people are right to fight for their rights. Why do they have to lower themselves to other airlines (in terms of pay and conditions), when in fact the others should improve their conditions. Incidentally, it is said that a BA crew earn double than a Virgin one, what everybody fails to highlight is that Virgin crew get their allowances cash in hand!
Do you really think that BA will lower their prices when they can afford to charge a premium for leaving from LHR and they are more convenient in term of routes....well think again. They will just charge the same and will continue reducing the quality of food... on board as they are already doing now.
Bet you in around 3 years time, they will claim they have hit the £1billion profit (remember it was not that long ago that they had a profit of £800 million), and who will get all the benefits, greedy CEO, shareholders but nothing for lower workers.
This world is being run by a bunch of greedy pigs.
If you compare salaries on the continent, the disparity between top managers and lower paid workers is not as high as in the UK or America, why because people fight for their rights.
we are in 2010 and if we let all the big companies let whatever they want to do, we would be living in 1960s style!
Good on them for fighting for their rights.
By the way why aren't all tube workers, civil servants, train drivers... talked about so much: WELL BECAUSE THEIR COMPANIES DO NOT TELL THE PRESS WHATEVER THEY WANT TO AND MAKE ALL THE DAILY MAIL READERS BELIEVE ANY RUBBISH.
batraveller2 - 24/03/2010 19:23 GMT
I have never heard such rubbish as the above statement. Whilst not a fan of Willie Walsh, I think he has handled the situation in an excellent manner and is standing up to Unite. These are tough times and WW is trying to help the airline survive unlike Unite.
As for service, there have been some cutbacks, but New Club World is still an excellent product and on the whole excellent service. If it requires a few cutbacks on the champagne, I do not think this is the end of the world, and is not unique to BA. If anything does go wrong, BA are one of the best at helping you with onward connections / rebooking or providing hotel accommodation even when they strictly may not need to. I am happy to pay a slight premium for knowing that I will not be left stranded.
I have booked Club flights at the start of April and 2 in the summer for holiday to San Francisco and have every confidence in BA.
I think Willie Walsh has handled this excellently of recent, and the union are frustrated that he arranged strong contingency plans, thus limiting the impact of their strike.
NTarrant - 24/03/2010 20:28 GMT
Markymark that has to be the the biggest load of rubbish on this forum. If you want to start a thread about tube drivers then go ahead, but civil servants aren't travel providers.
I agree with exbatraveller, Willie Walsh is right not to give in to the union. I have every confidence in BA and will continue to support it even if I have another choice. The very good breakfast in Club Europe this morning, with a good cup of tea, served with a smile and a nice greeting is hard to beat.
BRUSHES - 25/03/2010 10:59 GMT
THE FLIGHT ATTENDANTS AND GROUND AND TERMINAL STAFFING PERSONNEL MAY NOT MAKE ALOT OF MONEY. BUT THE PERKS CAN ADD THOUSANDS OF STERLING/DOLLARS TO THEIR PAY/VALUE WITHOUT HAVING TO PAY INCOME TAX ON SUCH FREE OR VERY VERY DISCOUNTED TIX.. AND, OF COURSE, FAMILY MEMBERS FLY (WITH AIRLINE PERSONNEL) AT SAME LOW RATE. YEARS AGO, IT WAS NOTHING FOR A TWA FA (STEWARDS/STEWARDESSES THEN) TO FLY TO PARIS FOR A 1 DAY VACATION (FLYING FIRST CLASS OF COURSE) FROM THE U.S. COST PERHAPS $25.00 IN TAXES. OF COURSE, THEIR HOTEL WAS AT A DISCOUNTED RATE TOO. PEOPLE WANT THEIR CAKE AND TO EAT IT TOO. HOPE WILLIE DOES NOT GIVE IN.... BUT HE WILL.
oldbold - 25/03/2010 12:14 GMT
As a long-retired member of BA staff, it's arguable how valuable staff travel privileges might be to me. I have to buy multiple tickets to cover the possibility of not getting away, and then stand around at the barrier until it's time to run to the gate. I'm unable to travel in a class other than the lowest, unless I am very lucky. When travelling with my wife, it is unusual to be seated near her. And the tickets are emphatically not free. In fact, it is often cheaper to fly one of the low-cost carriers on a firm booking.
craigwatson - 25/03/2010 12:50 GMT
ah, but lets not forget how many BA crew commute from places all over the UK, and even the continent ( in this case, at preferencial tax rates). How many of us can expect our companies to pay for us to commute 100's of miles from our place of work. not many i'd wager. I expect this will be the biggest pill for the strikers to swallow if this is also included in revocation of staff travel.
Metmanmart - 25/03/2010 13:10 GMT
It appears that most of the posts are by people who read the newspapers..especially the DAILY MAIL who have it in for the hard working Cabin Crew..How many of you have actually read the agrrements..All the C/C I know are NOT striking just for money..There is more involved. What Walsh wants to IMPOSE are what they are fighting for..Less days off..quicker turnarounds..new fleet employing labour at much lower rates..loss of seniority..Lots of other smaller things..Walsh wants to run BA on a Ryanair basis..Is that what you want..I certainly dont..Maybe there shouldn't be a strike, but thats what everyone has the right to do..He also wants to break the Union..If this happens then all the people writing here who belong to a Union had better watch out..Once this starts then there is no end..Yes..Everyone should get round the table but it is NOT all the Union and C/C's fault.. BA has a lot to answer for as well..As to the perks..Anyone who uses these knows what problems are involved..Staff Travel is based on Seat Availability..You have to wait aroundnot knowing if you can travel or not..We understand this and appreciate this but don't think it all plain sailing...maybe others should try this and then see what it entails..I agree with oldbold entirely..I will continue to support the C/C but would be happier if they all got around the table AGAIN..
ichtop1% - 25/03/2010 13:18 GMT
I dont read the DM.........i dont belong in a union...........i dont work for an airline..........i dont get 'perks' of free/discounted flights......i dont get perks full stop...........i'm just of the unfortunate people who rely on an airline to get me to where i want to go. Funnily enough i flew with Ryanair last weekend. We got away on time, we returned on time, it may have beeen a little short on leg room, it may have been cattle class, but it got there.......unlike a few friends, who didnt!
The point is that the general public, who are fed up with it all, will eventually stop booking with BA and the union will then be fighting on the grounds of redundancy, and then probably strike as a result......and so it goes.
It's modern economics and business practice to cut costs. Striking is not the answer, when will the unions ever learn.
markymark - 25/03/2010 13:46 GMT
I have asked my flatmate to check how much it would cost him to go to Brussels and Berlin on standby: return tickets £81.90 and £79.00 respectively.
Well if it is what you call heavily discounted, think again, you can go for similar prices on low cost airlines. Don't forget that if the flight is full, they don't get on board (therefore when downroute, you might have to pay for a hotel at the last minute since you will only find out whether you get on-board or not just when the flight is closing).
They have to pay airport tax like anyone else too
So as Brushes said $25 to go to Paris, that was 25 years ago, things have changed and airlines have realised that it is a good way to make money and fill in empty seats. REMEMBER, these are standby tickets, if the flight is full, you don't get on, so the airline has nothing to lose!
Oh and they have to pay a non-refundable fee of £1.95 per sector per person for website maintenance.
The bottom line is that BA is punishing staff for participating in a legal strike, they are therefore acting illegally.
RedFlyer - 25/03/2010 13:47 GMT
Ichtop1% - We can't help it if you are on the dole!!!
Removing a 'perk' for going on strike is quite simply blackmail. No two ways about it.
Anybody who hasn't travelled standby cannot make a comment on the 'value' of the perk as you do not understand the despair of being stuck at an airport for day after day. Try that and see if your opinion remains the same.
craigwatson - 25/03/2010 13:58 GMT
RedFlyer. you say "removing a perk for going on strike is quite simply blackmail", then you go on to say how hard done by you are for having to travel standby, and the inherant dangers that entails.... well I guess you wont mind losing them then.
ichtop1% - 25/03/2010 14:07 GMT
Redflyer....is it possible to have a discussion without being insulting! I've worked for the same company for 25 years, never been out of work since school, well paid, and well mannered!
It's talk like that which causes the unions to have such a poor reputation, warrented or not.
If the perks arent perks, then there will be no problem losing them, so what is your argument there?
Oh, and i have spent time at an airport.....waiting..........for a BA aircraft to take me home.............it didnt........guess why? Yep, strike action!
