Some interesting news out of Auckland on the launch of a "lie-flat bed" in ANZ's economy cabin:

http://www.businesstraveller.com/news/air-new-zealand-to-launch-a-lie-flata-economy

What do readers think of the concept?

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What next? They will follow this by giving them decent food in economy as well. I'm more in favour of the Ryanair approach, making them stand for the flight. Seriously, as someone who mixes economy and business travel, this could be interesting, depending on the pricing structure adopted.

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As an NZ Gold frequent flyer, who usually flies in business premier or premium economy, it is an interesting proposition. If travelling as a couple I'd seriously consider this over premium economy. Given most NZ long haul flights are overnight, I would have thought it would be a serious option for couples.

The premium economy product is getting up with the best too, with a 2-2-2 configuration on a 77W, this is looking a lot closer to business class of not too long ago. It will be particularly interesting to see the reaction on the highly competitive LAX-LHR route as NZ will be light years ahead of BA and VS, let alone UA, AA and DL.

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What happens during turbulence if you are sleeping across the seats in economy? Is there a new design of seatbelt to enable the user to strap themselves in - otherwise they will have to be woken each time the seatbelt sign comes on...

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I am sure that there will be a market for this, I can't say that it would be what I'm personally looking for. From the pictures it does not look that comfortable and as excessbaggae says what happens if there is turbulence.

I have only flown three times with ANZ and all in economy and was impressed by the service and food. The IFE is far better than any other I have used. As I say I am sure there will be a market for this particularly given the length of some of ANZ flights

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I've just added a few larger images to the piece which give a better impression of the new offerings in economy and premium economy:

http://www.businesstraveller.com/news/air-new-zealand-to-launch-a-lie-flata-economy

I've also contacted our reporter Andrew Gough who is still out in New Zealand, to see if he can clarify the query about seatbelts in economy.

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Thanks Business Traveller - the premium economy seat looks great - almost like a business class offering!

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A nice innovation for vertically-challenged couples who like spooning - I wonder how many people will get tripped up over feet sticking out into the aisles?!

And did you notice hidden in some of the publicity photos, the configuration for the rest of the poor sods in economy? 3-4-3 just like EK and KL. Maybe ANZ isn't being so wonderfully generous after all...

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Good point cityprofessional - it would be interesting to know what the length of the three seats put together is? I think the seat width of an economy class seat is around 18 inches, which would equate to 54 inches or 4.5 feet - not really enough for a proper bed!

This probably doesn't include the armrests though, so i may be doing them a slight disservice...

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Hats off to NZ for doing something to both Economy and Premium Economy. So many of their flights are ultra-long-haul (for me, ten plus hours in the air is ultra long haul), this would be an ideal solution, esp. for a couple or a family with a small child.

Apart from seatbelts, what about being seated on your own when loads are light - will the seats be operating as normal seats, or could you make a bed out of it?

The new Premium Economy looks super. Air NZ already serve a business class style meal (take note other carriers) which makes this product very attractive. And the new Business Premier obviously works - to the point where Air NZ have a new patent on the seat.

Anyone note the new crew uniform? That pink sure is...um...different.

Well done, Air NZ! Top carrier for innovation 2010, I think!

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Product innovation is excellent to see in an industry so blighted by stories of product and service downgrades. It's probably particulary essential for small carriers like Air New Zealand, since all their long haul routes operate in competition with other carriers - and announcements like this maintain their share-of-voice.

The Premium Economy seat will be the one to watch, I think, especially with its offset 2-2-2 configuration and super cabin ambience. Business class catering for PE passengers is also a serious differentiator and helps justify the not-inconsiderable incremental cost of PE over Y.

Of course, the principal driver behind the inclusion of J catering in PE was the mixed-class upper deck on the 744s that these new 777s are slated to replace. With that practical, operational necessity removed, Air New Zealand will hopefully maintain their conviction that it's a worthy component of the soft product. The omens are good; the slightly less-fanfared announcements about general catering improvements (especially in terms of galley equipment) are very welcome indeed, though they will depend hugely on getting the Auckland crews (who are every bit as fractious as Finnair's and BA's!) behind the new service standards.

Only time will tell whether the CX Y-style seat adjustment in PE will prove as comfortable as the more traditional fixed squab and tilting backrest arrangement.

The Skycouch is, naturally of course, today's headline-grabber, though I think the practical implications of the seat, in use, are hugely compromised. As excessbaggage says, a quick bit of maths (the average 777 Y seat width is actually 17.5ins) produces a combined seat width which cannot, including armrests and frames, be even 5 feet long. You'll note from the press photos that the models actually have their heads up the sidewall of the aircraft. You'll also note that the seats fore of the recumbent models are upright, whilst those they occupy are reclined. As Air New Zealand are not adopting shell-style seats in Y, encroachment into the Skycouch space will take place.

The suggestion of a 1100USD per flight fee between the two passengers occupying the Skycouch is not inconsiderable in the acutely price-sensitive Y-cabin, and there are bound to be issues when passengers who've paid the fee board a lightly-loaded service and believe (rightly-or-wrongly) that they could have avoided the fee if they'd known that seats would have been unoccupied anyway. Remember, specifically, that these seats can only be of interest to leisure travellers, not business ones (unless they're very close!) and leisure travellers are more likely to buy on price than schedule, loyalty, or regular experience.

If the seats do indeed prove successful commercially, and they generate licensing revenue for Air New Zealand, then it will be excellent news for the company and indeed the country, as it will help secure their long term self-determination in terms of aviation.

Also excellent are those new uniforms; a huge improvement on the old!

Speaking honestly though, and putting my neck on the line, I think the seats will end up being given away free to status-holders travelling in pairs, if not consigned to the same place as airline ash trays fairly shortly.

Overall though, it's great to see airline good news that's not just about First Class.

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These new products look and sound great.

Have we now come full circle? ANZ are offering three classes - standard economy, value and confort-conscious premium and very expensive luxury. Leaving aside the brand names, 10 years ago they would have been described as economy, business and first.

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Hi everyone !! ANZ it is your stage and spotlight !

We have waited for such bold innovations in Economy Class and it is surprising and great that ANZ really upholds its good name and products in both Prem. Economy and Economy. As I am a fan of full flat bed--it is a big "yes" for the Skycouch ! Whether it could be smaller for some--it is still a great way to lounge or sleep in those seats/space --regarding other Y pax being disturbed because of your lounging or sleeping position--believe me a lot of them would refer on booking a skycouch in their flights inorder to have the freedom of space and mobility in such long haul flights, the odd look about occupying three seats for one person or two will only be in the beginning as it will be a common sight in the future. It is also good to hear that improvements on catering has been done as well !

Just a huge " kudos" to those in ANZ !! This really shows other competitors in the market that you have taken the issues of pax regarding improvements in Prem. Eco and Economy Class seriously and by responding to it with a huge idea and really innovative approach --- I am a fan of ANZ Prem Eco before--now I have the new Prem Eco and the Skycouch to choose from and this makes me more a huge fan!--definitely a huge success as here the customers/pax are the winners !

Thanks ANZ !! Sincerly I wished I had expected such things from BA--well you can't have everything--right !

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A couple of points to add about the new offering. The premium economy seat will feature a recline of nine inches, and the layout of the 777-300ER aircraft will be as follows:

246 in economy (including 66 seats creating 22 Skycouch combinations), 50 in premium economy and 44 in Business Premier.

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Indeed, all looks very refreshing, innovative. For once, concentrating on something for the benefit of the traveller, rather than purely seen to rake in extra cash for some failing Airlines.

Business travel has changed. We all know this, see it, feel it on BT.

Airlines need to be in step with this, not with the recent imposing of changes, that are felt strongly by the traveller (Food, luggage allowance, Seat allocations, FFP benefits etc). Like any business approach, you lose loyalty if you don't inform, involve, & communicate management of change, as in any large Organisation. ANZ Have the teams to bring creativity a-new, cutting edge,Unique, not easy in the mass of concepts in the Airline Industry today. This is a reflection of listening to customer responses, monitoring the market correctly & responding to it, & sincerely trying to offer a better quality of experience of travel.

This is a very effective strategy, of securing their customer base, through a unique, high quality travel experience. In this way they will have greater demand for their services. The "strategies" of some airlines, clearly have put at great risk their customer base, loyalty, & financial future. It is not with short term gain/ Instant Financial gratification changes, as carried out by BA. Cramming more of us in on an Aircraft, cutting the services & facilities, & charging more, will NOT work. I for one, am avoiding such airlines, my loyalty & business will remain with those operating ethically, & fairly to us as Travellers.

This is a huge sector where choice is abundant. Such an Airline deserves to fly without their seats being unoccupied, even if they fit less people in, the Load factors will be much higher. A very sensible & fair business strategy. Congratulations to ANZ...its just a pity you are not the UK's National Airline...then we would have something to be very proud of!

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On a few occasions I have been lucky enough to be travelling on a lightly loaded flight and managed to obtain three joining economy seats to myself. With the arm rests flipped up I was able to get a good sleep, even though the seats cushions where not specifically designed for this lying position. A few blankets helped to improve the comfort in the area under the arm rests.

After the first time this happened I worked out purchasing three discounted economy seats was considerably cheaper than buying one business class seat. This was many years ago, not during a recession, so discounted business class seats were not so easily available. Although very tempted, I have never tried to make a booking for three economy as I feared there could be problems at check-in and boarding. Ensuring the airline would honour the second and third seat when there is only one person travelling. Would their computer system think the second and third seats are for a no show passengers and if the flight was over booked allocate them to other people? Or just as bad not keep the three seats reserved next to each other?

It is great to see ANZ expand on this concept. However, any airline which could solve the concerns I have previously mentioned and honour three seat seats together for a single traveller, would gain my interest. Even with the current seat and without a continuous cushion. Obviously, this would only work where the seat arm rests flip up. i.e. Not in BA World Traveller plus which has fixed arm rests.

Other considerations: 1) If I bought three seats and actually flew then could I claim for triple miles and tier points. Probably not. 2) I would probably be entitled to pay less UK passenger departure tax too. I doubt the computers could cope with that either.

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It's perhaps worth clarifying that Air New Zealand will be moving to ten-abreast in Y on these new aircraft (from the current nine on their existing 777s), with a seat pitch an inch less than that enjoyed by Pacific Economy passengers on their current 744s (though an inch more than their 777s).

For the up to 180 Y passengers who are not seated on Skycouches therefore, and for those who are seated in Skycouch seats but who have not paid the supplement, this is arguably a significantly retrograde development in terms of personal space.

The increased space-take of PE has got to be paid back from somewhere - and that's Y pitch and width in this case.

The upgrades to IFE screens, connectivity etc in Y will mitigate the impact somewhat, of course - but NZ's Y seat pitch has long been the foundation of much of its leisure-market communications, so a new promotional strategy will be required. Perhaps, of course, it's hoped that the noise created by Skycouch will take up the space once occupied by the 34" message.

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Agreed with the above. But economy is all about economy. Cheap is more important than comfortable. Customers that won't pay a £500 premium for a flat bed often won't pay a £20 premium to have 34 inches rather than 32. Commercially, airlines have to make economy cheaper rather than better.

Premium classes have to be made better rather than cheaper (flat beds etc.). This creates a bigger and bigger gap between the two both in terms of price and comfort - hence the filling of the gap by new products such as premium economy, extra legroom seats and, now, impromptu sofas.

Airlines won't like issuing 'empty seat tickets'.But it would be the simplest thing in the world (and therefore inordinately difficult) to enable a passenger to 'block' a seat at booking or OLCI, for a fee of course.

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MichelAngelo: you're absolutely right about Economy being all about economy. It's remarkable how many (particularly but not exclusively) leisure passengers willingly go for a £20/2.5% round-trip saving but lumber themselves with a 7 hour or 9 hour connection that they only regret when it's too late.

Lots of them, of course, are on once-in-a-lifetime trips when the Antipodes are involved, and the chances of them making another trip like that in the short term are limited - though admittedly growing as the years pass and propensity to travel grows - so repeat custom, recommendation and referral is less of an issue/risk.

The snag for NZ in this market is, and has always been, that it can't compete with the cost base of the Asian and Mid East carriers to Asia and points West and, to a certain extent, with the US ones going the other way. Their lower-cost, outsourced Zeal crews only operate A320s, not long haul. So, accepting that their fares were always going to be higher in Y than MH, TG, EK and even SQ and CX, they went down the route of a clear differentiator with 34" pitch.

This then marks quite a significant change for them - perhaps the way that they've crunched the numbers apes BA's model slightly more, and majors on premium yields to support effectively subsidised Y fares.

I still think that the Skycouch is PR-spin and little more though. TV3 in NZ are reporting a likely fare of 7000NZD (3000GBP) AKL-LHR for a couple. That's 1500GBP each, when EK are selling Y at 687GBP and CX at 699GBP this year.

I wish NZ well, and I'm really impressed by the potential of the PE cabin in particular, but were I a shareholder I'd seriously question any significant revenue forecasts being pinned on Skycouch.

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Hi everyone, and greetings from sunny Auckland.

To answer the query about seatbelts, here's what ANZ said:

"The ‘normal’ seatbelts on the seat have been made slightly longer to allow the flexibility for someone to use them while they are lying down. When a second person is also lying down beside them, then they would be given a standard extension seat belt to loop through the first person’s belt similar to how infants are dealt with today.

"Provided the passengers use it in this way there is no reason to wake them for turbulence."

Also, picking up on another point raised, the B777-300ER economy seats are actually narrower than on the B777-200ER, at 17" rather than 17.8". ANZ has also slimmed down the aisles in the EC cabin, allowing it to squeeze in a 3-4-3 configuration on the new plane, as opposed to the 777-2's 3-3-3.

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PE seats 2-2.5 x price of economy on various routes, Airlines that have this cabin. LHR Sydney for eg, £500-800 Y, PE from £1,150+, & business (was in Sept with SQ) £1,900, but now more around £3,200+.

Many Business cabins are taken up at the moment on Long Haul down to Australia, by personal travellers, those who pay for their own tickets. You would be surprised how many travel regularly, & pay out more, but not the full business class fares. Its not the once only Antipodean trippers!

I travel to Australia twice a year, as well as 30 flights + in Europe, then there are the medium haul trips both leisure & business. After all, it is the Business sector that has restricted spending of their staff, not the premium leisure travellers who are paying more...hence the meeting of both, fuellng more interest in PE options.

Clearly for ANZ, pricing will be crucial, if the value is more then PE, even lying down for a while in part of the converted cabin, your services & seat are probably better value in PE. Lucky with ANZ, that they have Long haul sectors worldwide, sot his would work for their geographical location, & routes. I don't think this particular model, would work for other Airlines, on various routes.

But ,all speed to them for change & trying something new, its very refreshing in these troubled times when all else seems to be being restricted or part cut, to see innovation.

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The SkyCouch is PR spin - nothing more than three economy seats (only slightly more than four feet long...) and a blanket and none of the other plusses of a premium experience, either on the ground or in the crowded cabin.

The salient issue here will resolve around the cost charged for the genuinely impressive PE offering; until this is explicit, it is hard to say whether this innovation is a genuine improvement for travellers; if it justs costs more then there is very little amelioration in true value.

Personally, I am not convinced by the "doesn't recline, just slides forward" shell concept seats; several colleagues have endured Cathay in the boot, and have vowed no=ever to do so again. Poor lambs.

Notwithstanding the above, I still believe that for *most* Air New Zealand economy travellers, this will be a retrograde step.

The new economy seats are actually a whole inch narrower than on the B777-200ER, at 17" rather than 17.8". The usual 34" pitch which was always a selling point of ANZ is also being reduced.

17" width for extra-longhaul is tight by anyone's measure.

ANZ has also slimmed down the aisles allowing it to squeeze in a 3-4-3 configuration on the new plane, as opposed to the 777-2's 3-3-3.

It is indeed nice to see innovation, but let's not kid ourselves that there is not a revenue maximisation motivation at the heart of this move.

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Gosh, that is a harsh review, VintageKrug...

Firstly, of course this is PR spin and revenue maximisation is a primary motivation, but this is an innovation nonetheless, and full credit to NZ for trying to think outside of the box. Economy is also a clearly superior product vs other airlines, and is not a retrograde step vs NZ's existing the 772. Yes, width has gone from 17.8 to 17, but pitch is up from 32 to 33, and compares favourably with BA/VS/KL's 31 and QF's 32

There are also clear improvements to the (already pretty nice) soft product - not to suggest that food ordering on demand, for example, is not a premium proposition would be churlish (especially when BA sneers at you when you request dine on demand, even in First)

As for shell seats in PE, is it really fair to compare with CX's 32" Y class seat? With an effective pitch of 40" due to the herringbone configuration, surely it is closer to a business lite offering? And with 2-2-2 seating it is light years ahead of any of the current PE offerings by BA/VS/QF/AF/NH and the like

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VK: Well if any airline didn't engage in revenue maximisation it would be failing to fit its true purpose. After all what are LCCs about, what is the demise of UK domestic business class about and why do both BA and VS have long haul economy class seat pitch that makes NZ look generous?

Do you expect economy class to be anything other than economy? What other carrier in economy class offers anything remotely similar for couples to have a small flat surface to lie across? Yes I'm first to criticise NZ for going 3-4-3 in a 777, but we are talking less than an inch in width. BA, VS, UA, LH and indeed most major carriers in economy have seat pitch in long haul the same as they have for short haul. Only some Asian carriers can rival NZ in economy.

In premium economy NZ is only outshone by BMI, which will soon be giving up the A330s. NZ's premium economy catering already outshines all others by a mile (BA gives the vile economy food and VS barely better). 2-2-2 beats 2-4-2 on BA in 777s anyday.

Hard shells that seats recline within are a feature of virtually all business and first class products today, can't quite see why it is a problem in premium economy.

The catering will be leaps and bounds ahead of all others in business premier, only rivalled by Austrian, which has an inferior hard product. Freshly cooked food outdoes the reheating we see in others.

So yes, NZ has successfully created a lot of spin. Every airline does for new products. AA's new business class was running to catch up with the middle of the pack, and BA's new First is a great enhancement but by no means seriously rivals SQ, CX, EK (A380), EY or LX.

I'm unhappy NZ is squeezing in another in Y, but then who besides those of us who follow this sort of thing avidly, knows or bothers? Neither VS nor BA have seen any advantage in increasing seat pitch in economy, because most economy travellers care about price, and then have an impression of how good or bad airline service is (although IFE matters). Airlines rarely sell economy class on seat pitch and width, and only a small number of customers bother researching or give a damn. Those in the front cabins are different, because quality of product is at least as important. Those customers make tradeoffs on fare and quality. What NZ has done is give this option to couples in economy as well.

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It seems that I might be out of step with at least one member of NZ crew's view on the new uniform!

The NZ Dominion Post:

http://bit.ly/6SkkLE

And the slightly more sensational UK Daily Mail:

http://bit.ly/5VAgMh

It does seem notable that response to the new seats (particularly Y) on NZ message boards, and even on FlyerTalk, is fairly muted. As is almost always the case, the national airline's reputation overseas is considerably better than it is amongst those who are presented with less choice but to fly it.....

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Unfortunately not all the readers (like me) can afford a fancy Y seat so I have checked directly with Air New Zealand if it was true that the new 777 will have 3-4-3 configuration and I was told NO, it will remain 3-3-3.

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giramondo: I'm afraid that you've been given incorrect information there. The new configuration is absolutely 3-4-3, as this photo from the launch shows clearly:

http://bit.ly/csnMWv

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Regarding the length of the Skycouch (ie: the three seats sold together in economy), Air New Zealand has informed us that this is 1.56 metres.

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Let's hope the Cabin Crew don't have Kathy Bates-style proclivities while wheeling the trolley down the (even narrower) aisles, or there could be a few hobbled passengers being stretchered off Air NZ flights.

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..I just have waited that our typical VK who is full of BA stereotypes will be commenting "grandly" over the new Prem Y of ANZ..Well, that means you are not flying with ANZ ,isn't? Afraid to be a hobbled pax being stretched out--good...just leave those who like flying with ANZ and enjoy the great service ANZ delivers which BA has not reached till today ! Best in all classes comparing to BA ! It is sad that BA haven't considered in improving Economy cabin at all. WTP is comparing to the new ANZ's wider seats and the great Business Class meals and beverages absolutely mediocre and more an Economy Class than a a Premium Economy( just forget to do some homeworks like fellow Qantas--I supposed ..?)

But perhaps you will not fly ANZ 'cause you won't get your typical BA shareholder discounts--well lucky for those who can pay the full price !

ANZ has at least the courage and view for innovations and considering their customers' suggestions--" the so called world's favourite airline" has in th past only ears for a small group of BA elite travellers and definitely ignoring the mass of Economy pax. That's why those pax are preferring to fly with ANZ and other airlines beside BA .

There is one thing BA can learn from this new approach of ANZ--BA you should be doing your homeworks and from time to time try and read and evaluate rightly what your Economy and Premium Economy pax wants--not only the comments of mostly upgraded BA Exec Club silver or gold card holders who are normally happy to be upgraded and really oversees faults in such flights as they wouldn't want to be ungrateful, aren't they? This goes to those who are grandly being bumped to Club World as well....

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...BA should be courageous and should give those questionnaires to the mass of Economy pax--than BA could see what those people really think of its Eco and Prem Eco cabins. But in reality--the CSD mostly give those questionnaires to BA Exec Club gold and silver holders on board... BA should take the time and opportunity to refurbish Economy and WTP after all this mayhem with the First Class cabin. Perhaps here BA could score again grandly like in the good old times...with great seats and services ...hmm, if that time has already arrived and enjoying it in a BA cabin..that would be really great !

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Hello Hess, clearly you are well! Sorry my friend but this is a thread about ANZ not BA. As I said earlier ANZ does provide a very good service but I would say that they are an equal match to BA. Where ANZ has the edge on BA IMHO is the IFE, even in economy. As for the questionaires, I know a number of perople who have travelled economy and received them and they are not Gold and Silver Exec holders. My wife is Blue and has received one on many occasions and when my PA and I used to have to travel SOU-MAN in BA days she got one and she had no exec card.

Getting back to ANZ the economy beds at 1.56m would not be for me even if I wanted it as my feet would end up in the aisle. So don't knock VK for his comment there, he is right.

Cheers and hope you are sipping that red wine!!

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US railways worked out 90 years ago how to pack passengers into their long distance economy class coaches and give them all a bed and a bit of privacy to boot.

It would be interesting to know how much space they allowed per passenger compared with ANZ's new offering. One big difference is that on the railways one has bunk beds - two or even three layers of sleeping passengers per 6 foot floor space.

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Don't forget that Lufthansa was making an offering not so long ago, for the Economy Bunk beds! We have gone forwards, & sidewards in the cabin, why not upwards now?!

I applaud ANZ, in these stale Industry times, especially when several Airlines appear all spin, to mask cuts & glorify failing travel experiences. It sounds like 10 Downing Street these days... For a relatively small Airline, with a specific corner of the world as a base, It really does span the globe, & has a remarkable unmoving reputation over many years. No doubt, their fresh & innovative approach, will keep them there much longer after other Airlines have dealt with their liabilities, & down-sized, along with their share price & Financial liabilities.

I would be very interested to see those on BT, expressing the regular pro one Airline banter, actually did pay for their own seats ever? The loudest & most pretentious in the lounges are usually the obnoxious who have little work status, never pay for their own tickets, & more wanna-be's that actual Are's.

Perhaps BT should make a survey of the frequent travellers on here...and see who spends their own money in leisure time, not paid for buy others, & travels Premium classes?

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ANZ sets the standard again! What a great idea and improvement over any other carriers' offering.

This will be a hit!

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Of late the BT forum writers discussing only the virtue (or not) of BA and try to find faults with most other airlines. Over the last 10 years, there is hardly any innovation by BA, whereas there are many innovation by quite a number of airlines. Each innovation is liked by a certain segments of passengers. I find the ANZ innovation is quite good - one shall refrain from negative comments without first experiencing it first.

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There is no doubt this is innovative stuff from Air NZ, and its commendable that they are trying something different. But I am not convinced it will actually improve the experience for passengers, especially when the increased cost of tickets is taken into account.

The three rows as a bed concept is impractical for all but the shortest pax, and will result in tighter seats for all other in economy.

The PE product does look great, but has a slide forward rather than proper recline, which has been criticised by regular Cathay travellers as uncomfortable.

The Business Class seat (a Virgin Atlantic licenced knock-off) is still clunky as you need to get out of your reclined seat to switch into bed mode.

Especially considering BAs size, it has a long reputation for innovation, and I would say that 2009 was actually one of BA's most innovative years.

Far from there being "hardly any innovation at BA over the past ten years", here is an (incomplete) list of worthy examples:

2000

- Introduction of World Traveller Plus Cabin, fleetwide (the first four class airline)

- Introduction of longhaul Club World flat beds, fleetwide

- Introduction of shorthaul Club Europe convertible seating, fleetwide

- Introduction of onbusiness corporate rewards scheme (the first such scheme of its type)

2001

- £14m upgrade to Concorde interior

- total redesign of T4 "Lounge Pavilion" First and Concorde Room (the latter by Terence Conran)

- ba.com becomes functional for online e-ticketing

- Investment of £17m in Concorde safety improvements sees her return to flight

- British Airways won the prestigious Grand Prix Award for International Design Effectiveness for the new Club World seat which turned into a six-foot fully flat bed. The award was given in recognition of how the product had revolutionised business travel. The seat also won the best consumer product award.

2002

- removal of Saturday night stay restriction on most European fares

- further A321 orders for shorthaul

2003

- Connexion on board internet trialled on a BA 747

2004

- launch of codeshares across the pond with AA

- WiFi available in all BA Terraces lounges globally

2005

- carbon offsetting introduced as an option for customers

2006

- noise cancelling headphones in Club World

- Raid the larder in Club and Tuck Box introduced in World Traveller/WT+

- light touch Club World cabin refresh, with softer cushioning and newly designed interior

2007

- AVOD Video on demand rolled out in all classes

- Worldwide "Galleries" Lounge concept premieres in Brussels

- BA announced their biggest $8billion order since 1998 by ordering 36 new long-haul aircraft. 12 A380s with options on a further seven, and 24 Boeing 787s with options on a further 18.

2008

- Terminal 5 opens, with a £100m investment in BA Lounges

- www.newclubworld.com installed on all 57 747s

- ba.com online functionality now available in 11 languages

- Open Skies airline subsidiary launched between Paris and New York

- BA mobile check in launched at BA2go.com

2009

- Club World London City, the first scheduled transatlantic A318, launched

- New services to Las Vegas, Maldives, Punta Cana, Sharm El Sheikh

- New 777 and airbus shorthaul fleet deliveries continue

- BAEC Sale Offer: All redemptions made 50% off for the first time ever

- T5B Gallleries and Elemis Spa open

- BA opens brand new First and Galleries lounges in T3, and new lounge facilities in Mumbai

- Winner of 2009 Globe Travel Award for Innovation (Travel Weekly/Associated Newspapers)

2010

- First redesign launched at www.ba.com/first

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Vintage Krug: I agree many innovations by BA over the years, however at the same time BA's lack of maintenance -experienced first hand- resulting in broken down chairs, VOD that does not work on flights from Oz to LHR and many more annoying issues combined with an ever decline in motivation of it's cabin crew (resulting in a severe decline in customer service) make them no longer a premier airline. Further, the service at T5 and the attitude of ground staff there is one of the worst for a major transit hub from what I have experienced. In short I try to avoid BA whenever I can based on a string of bad experience.

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VK,

The type of passengers who would find the planned ANZ new economy class fold-down "berths" beneficial and ENJOYABLE are the likes of Tattoo (Herve Villechize), the midget assistant of Mr Roarke of the popular TV series "Fantasy Island"

I never make fun of the others but rather a pragmatic comparasion!

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VK must be the only person who thinks that wifi, buying a 777 or flying to Las Vegas are innovations. BA has had ONE true innovation in the past decade and that was Club World - nothing else they have done on any kind of scale is remotely groundbreaking

Back on topic, you may not like these NZ designs and, haha, we may joke they are not great for tall people or non-intimate couples, but you cannot deny they are innovative. And it's been said before (but clearly the poster has not noticed), the NZ PE seat can hardly be compared with the CX Y seat, given that it's 50% wider and 25% longer... Cos, like, ohmigod, I can't believe BA has fixed shell seats in New First and LCY Club when regular CX travellers don't think they are very comfortable in Y...

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Hi everyone !!

are we talking about innovations of Economy seats or BA Club World or Premium Class amenities or developments in this thread?

ANZ's Economy Class has improved, redefined itself and evolved for a more flexible choice of paxs' wishes. Whether your small, tall, skinny or fat. More import ANZ gives you as Y pax the freedom to choose how many seats you want to occupy in Y class, of course for a certain amount of surcharges. Lets face some BA die hard fans out there--whojust can't stand that airlines like ANZ has the courage and spirit to be innovated in Y cabin while others just ignored Y cabin completely. That ANZ has just been the first to implement it and not just talkings like LH with its full flat bunks in Y cabin. It is up to the airlines how they improved their products and when they do this--but do not forget to miss your call--otherwise the pax just moved on and the airlines who fail to come along are just left behind.

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Hess963

You are spot on with ANZ having the vision and leading the aiirline industry by offering inovative economy class seating products, in either PE or the lie-flat seats.

I have flown on every type of seats in all classes around the world and not being snobbish about travelling in economy class sometime.

I am completely supportive of this trend. I do not favour any airlines including my defecto "flag carrier" Cathay Pacific.

I still maintain my earlier comment as to the real benefit to the majority of the economy class passengers who select to pay for this additional enhancement feature. I am average 1.7m (5'7") in height and can not see myself being completely comfortable when lying on a surface of less than 1.6m, that is subtracting at least 3-4cm off for the pillow space. Curling up for a long period in that position is not relaxing, especially fearing having one's feet getting chopped off by a moving trolly!

This discussion is all about comfort level here at afordable prices. . Shorter people or smaller children might find the facility adequate for space, not 6-footers! I wish ANZ all the sucesses with the launch of their new economy class products and by giving economy class passengers more choices but doubtful if any airlines can extract huge profits from the economy class service as we all know too well that the premium front cabins are really the cash cow for all airlines!

However as the business travel spending pattern is changing rapidly world-wide there is no sign of any revival. Other air carriers might have no choice but to chase after this "new money" in the future!

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The last significant innovations in Y have been:

- Fixed shell seats (CX - notwithstanding criticism of the seat); - At seat IFE, particular AVOD (SQ).

You struggle to ever see innovation in Y from European carriers.

NZ have innovated in both Y and PE this time, but I think comparing the new PE to CX Y fixed shell seats is as valid as comparing it to BA Club World - which is also a seat that reclines forward in a shell.

BA's real innovations (as in a leap forward for passenger cabins that no other airline did first) are in the past decade: - WT+ (now looking a bit tired); - New Club World (NGCW is nice, but others rival it easily enough). I like BA a lot, but none of the others listed by VK meet the definition of "innovation", more improvement (and I could throw together a list about as long that NZ has engaged in, from Space + on domestic and tasman routes, notwithstanding that short haul business class on NZ and QF both outdo any European carrier by a long shot with the comprehensive rip off that is "same seats more food and empty seat beside you".)

Speculation about the price of NZ Y Skycouch and PE is just that. NZ will face price pressure in PE especially when/if CX and MH roll out their products. QF has only relatively recently introduced PE on AKL-LAX.

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We've just published an extensive interview with Ed Sims, ANZ's group general manager international airlines, about the launch of its new Skycouch seating in economy, and the controversial decision to move to a 3-4-3 layout. This can be read at:

http://www.businesstraveller.com/news/focus-air-new-zealands-skycouch

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I've just come across the following videos of the original press launch with Rob Fyfe, showing firstly the SkyCouch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHGU_c5E_Hw

And the Premium Economy product:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxJpTpgbyas

The latter video, in particular, gives some useful perspectives on the rears of the PE shells, showing the tray table and screen armatures, as well as the 'Otto' footrest.

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As ever, Air NZ have started advertising their new products in what can only be described as a light hearted way, using their latest "addition", Rico. Take a look at the videos uploaded - warning: not suitable for those with no sense of humour.

http://www.youtube.com/user/airnewzealand

Merry Christmas one and all.

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Great 'on the edge' humour from Rico !

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Well done ANZ. The problem with BA is they well innovate (or slightly improve on their own offerings, whichever way you may wish to look at it). But it takes them far too long to roll out changes across their fleet due to internal bureaucracy or size which renders them near obsolete at completion.

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Air New Zealand took delivery of its newest 777-300ER, i found this video at Boeing's site which shows the Skycouch and the new Premium economy Cabin.

http://www.boeing.com/newairplane/777/customerHighlights/

Regards

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There you go NZ! I like the innovation that you got. It answers to quuestions of: Maximising revenues for Aircraft that always stick to the wieght restricted route in which the cargo is to precious to eliminate. Boom, you don't have to bump any passaenger at all (if you set the fee of obtaining the sky-couch reasonable enough) course all seats will fill up.

The question of wooing your precious FF loyalties with out sacrificing numerous upper class seats (or more space like in United's case)

My suggestions of the best combinations of inflight-product for an aircraft (example A380) is to include Emirate's First Suite, Korean's Business, Zelander's Premium Economic and their Economy seats + sky couch

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BusinessTraveller, have a look at this photo, which I think shows the seat in a very attractive light and could even tempt me, a seasoned F and sometimes C travelller.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Air-New-Zealand/Boeing-777-319/ER/1857187/L/

In fairness, I think your photo's are probably more realistic of the way the seat will be used, and I do wonder if ANZ would actually make the bed up for you like this. I look forward to one of your flight reviews on the product!

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The latest Air New Zealand adverts:

http://bit.ly/qcupDc

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